Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why Adrian Lam is excited

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First Try Tickle
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by First Try Tickle » Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:39 am

SJ wrote:
Wintergreen wrote:The "Pre NZ" Sam was a once in a generation player. Someone worth the entrance fee alone to see.

The "Post NZ" Sam was an average player who, because of his exceptional talent, could occasionally play very well.

In terms of on the field rugby ability in 2018, Hardaker is streets ahead of Sam.

In terms of "thick as two short planks, been given more chances than most, can he really turn things around"?

That's the bit that worries me.
yes that's how I saw it. Why does a club like ours need to take such a risk?
Because before his ban he was the best player in this country by a mile, and if he can get this form back he will be fantastic under an attack minded coach.

And if we didn't take the risk, then another team would have. Both Saints and Wire were in need of a full back and their fans would have been happy with Zak.


SJ
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by SJ » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:10 am

First Try Tickle wrote:
SJ wrote:
Wintergreen wrote:The "Pre NZ" Sam was a once in a generation player. Someone worth the entrance fee alone to see.

The "Post NZ" Sam was an average player who, because of his exceptional talent, could occasionally play very well.

In terms of on the field rugby ability in 2018, Hardaker is streets ahead of Sam.

In terms of "thick as two short planks, been given more chances than most, can he really turn things around"?

That's the bit that worries me.
yes that's how I saw it. Why does a club like ours need to take such a risk?
Because before his ban he was the best player in this country by a mile, and if he can get this form back he will be fantastic under an attack minded coach.

And if we didn't take the risk, then another team would have. Both Saints and Wire were in need of a full back and their fans would have been happy with Zak.

I hear what you say FTT. But on the evidence of his antics to date to take him on inthe fear another team would recruit him and. he could become a reformed character is a risk I wouldn't have made. Perhaps that's why I'm not in the RL business If I was faced with a decision like that to make. Just hope the club have made the right decision and the lad shines

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TrueBlueWarrior
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by TrueBlueWarrior » Wed Dec 19, 2018 11:32 am

Exiled Wiganer wrote:Yeah, you never see Billy Slater, TVS or Tedesco run the ball. By all means argue that he could kick, point and pass well, but how anyone watching the game at the top level could conclude that good full backs don’t run the ball beggars belief. Though if Sam’s dad posts on here, I can understand the family loyalty.

If he had agreed to play for us at 7, then I think it would have been better for us and for Sam himself. Indeed, that was where Bennett saw him against the Kiwis.
So are you suggesting Sam is soft? Or do you think after his injuries and the fact we had 2 very strong running wingers it was common sense to use the wingers when possible so Sam could then use his energy more wisely to I don’t know................maybe help us win another GF?

You don’t have to be a family member to understand simple logic that WORKED!!
'If you start listening to the fans it won't be long before you're sitting with them.' - Wayne Bennett

pedro
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by pedro » Wed Dec 19, 2018 1:51 pm

Wintergreen wrote:The "Pre NZ" Sam was a once in a generation player. Someone worth the entrance fee alone to see.

The "Post NZ" Sam was an average player who, because of his exceptional talent, could occasionally play very well.

In terms of on the field rugby ability in 2018, Hardaker is streets ahead of Sam.

In terms of "thick as two short planks, been given more chances than most, can he really turn things around"?

That's the bit that worries me.
you cant say that as Hardaker hasnt played for over 18 months. Hock didnt come back the same player that left so its a risk.
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1857407490.png

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wall_of_voodoo
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by wall_of_voodoo » Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:59 pm

I think their would be a palpable difference from a player on the pitch being under the influence of drugs as opposed to one being pissed out of his skull.

Still if you want to make the connection.......

It will be very interesting to see if the Catalans wingers are so generous next season in doing all Sam's donkey work from full back. Yes. The game changes as do rules. However if a full back has neither the inclination nor ability to run the ball from defence then the reliance of the wingers is enormous. If they can't (or wont) do his job for him then Sam will be a spectacular flop - end of discussion!

TBH I can see him playing in the halves next season with Gigot full back
I'm a better fan than you
Because I don't "Boo"!!!

We never lose any games
We just don't win them (always the refs fault anyway)

fozzieskem
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by fozzieskem » Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:46 pm

wall_of_voodoo wrote:I think their would be a palpable difference from a player on the pitch being under the influence of drugs as opposed to one being pissed out of his skull.

Still if you want to make the connection.......

It will be very interesting to see if the Catalans wingers are so generous next season in doing all Sam's donkey work from full back. Yes. The game changes as do rules. However if a full back has neither the inclination nor ability to run the ball from defence then the reliance of the wingers is enormous. If they can't (or wont) do his job for him then Sam will be a spectacular flop - end of discussion!

TBH I can see him playing in the halves next season with Gigot full back
While I was reading your post I was just thinking I bet Sam plays in the halves next time out,Gigot was in fine fettle once he got going.

Exiled Wiganer
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by Exiled Wiganer » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:39 pm

TrueBlueWarrior wrote:
Exiled Wiganer wrote:Yeah, you never see Billy Slater, TVS or Tedesco run the ball. By all means argue that he could kick, point and pass well, but how anyone watching the game at the top level could conclude that good full backs don’t run the ball beggars belief. Though if Sam’s dad posts on here, I can understand the family loyalty.

If he had agreed to play for us at 7, then I think it would have been better for us and for Sam himself. Indeed, that was where Bennett saw him against the Kiwis.
So are you suggesting Sam is soft? Or do you think after his injuries and the fact we had 2 very strong running wingers it was common sense to use the wingers when possible so Sam could then use his energy more wisely to I don’t know................maybe help us win another GF?

You don’t have to be a family member to understand simple logic that WORKED!!
It isn’t logic at all. There were many reasons we are champions, but my response to the suggestion that the modern full back never runs the ball back. The best ones are all running threats as well as being an extra half.

josie andrews
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by josie andrews » Thu Dec 20, 2018 4:20 pm

fozzieskem wrote:
wall_of_voodoo wrote:I think their would be a palpable difference from a player on the pitch being under the influence of drugs as opposed to one being pissed out of his skull.

Still if you want to make the connection.......

It will be very interesting to see if the Catalans wingers are so generous next season in doing all Sam's donkey work from full back. Yes. The game changes as do rules. However if a full back has neither the inclination nor ability to run the ball from defence then the reliance of the wingers is enormous. If they can't (or wont) do his job for him then Sam will be a spectacular flop - end of discussion!

TBH I can see him playing in the halves next season with Gigot full back
While I was reading your post I was just thinking I bet Sam plays in the halves next time out,Gigot was in fine fettle once he got going.
Sam Tomkins has been given the squad number 29 for Catalans next season!
Anyone can support a team when it is winning, that takes no courage.
But to stand behind a team, to defend a team when it is down and really needs you,
that takes a lot of courage.

moto748
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by moto748 » Fri Dec 21, 2018 9:14 pm

So before his ban he was the best player in the country by a mile, but he patently wasn't good enough for the NRL? To take a name at random, Joe Burgess did better than that!

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wall_of_voodoo
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Re: Zak Hardaker back on board at Wigan Warriors... and here’s why...

Post by wall_of_voodoo » Sat Dec 22, 2018 12:28 pm

moto748 wrote:So before his ban he was the best player in the country by a mile, but he patently wasn't good enough for the NRL? To take a name at random, Joe Burgess did better than that!
Not if you ask and Sydney City Roosters fans he didn't :wink:

Look I am no raging Hardaker fan but facts speak for themselves. He is a king sized plonker in the true Rodney style. However, in the last five Super League Dream Teams from 2013 to 2018 Sam Tomkins was selected once (in 2013 prior to leaving for NZ and then all his injury history) Hardaker in 2014, 2015, and 2017 with Jamie Shaul getting the nod in 2016.

As we are aware Hardaker was banned for 2018 so was pretty unlikely to be selected for the "dream team" of 2018 yes?

Looking at things from that perspective. He must have been doing something at least pretty bog standard to be selected as often as he was. But that "bog standard" was better than any other full back going around at that time whether it be Ratchford/Shaul/Tomkins/Lomax or anyone else you care to mention
I'm a better fan than you
Because I don't "Boo"!!!

We never lose any games
We just don't win them (always the refs fault anyway)

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