Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Discuss all things Wigan Warriors. Comments and opinions on all aspects of the club's performance are welcome.
bertina
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by bertina » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:46 am

Too many fringe players taking up cap space that are never going to be good enough for regular super league rugby:
woods, Shorrocks, Ganson, forsyth, Wells, to name a few.
And for my money, you can add Tautai, Isa, and Powell to that list.

endoman
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by endoman » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:33 am

Squad is very large, yes I know sometimes we have to dig deep, but as the above poster says we have a lot of players who simply aren't going to be good enough taking up cap space. Lack of reserve games doesn't help. Even with nine out yesterday we still have a significant number of the squad who didn't get a game, it's hard to develop players under the cap. Balancing act it is for sure, but at the moment the scales are tipping the wrong way.

First Try Tickle
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by First Try Tickle » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:49 am

I do think the problem is Wigan don't seem to want to release anyone, and if they show anything they get new contract. We wonder why we cant seem to compete with the signing of Warrington and Saints, but we have so many players who just will not make it.

In Woods, Shorrocks and Ganson, we have 3 players all re-signed. But unless we have a major injury problem, I can't see any of them getting a game, and they have been here too long to break through. There are younger players who will be ahead of them soon so they need to be released. How long are we going to stick with Forsyth and Wells, both had a run in the team, but I can't see them getting back in. Forsyth is 23 in a couple of weeks, surely he is behind Hankinson and then where does that leave Worthington.

Rads just seems too nice to refuse a new contract to someone who's been at the club a while. He seems to think they deserve a new deal for sticking around, but its killing our salary cap.

Its depressed me typing this, as yesterday showed we have no strength in depth, but there as so many who didn't even get a look in that still count on the cap.

fozzieskem
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by fozzieskem » Mon Mar 04, 2019 11:29 am

First Try Tickle wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:49 am
I do think the problem is Wigan don't seem to want to release anyone, and if they show anything they get new contract. We wonder why we cant seem to compete with the signing of Warrington and Saints, but we have so many players who just will not make it.

In Woods, Shorrocks and Ganson, we have 3 players all re-signed. But unless we have a major injury problem, I can't see any of them getting a game, and they have been here too long to break through. There are younger players who will be ahead of them soon so they need to be released. How long are we going to stick with Forsyth and Wells, both had a run in the team, but I can't see them getting back in. Forsyth is 23 in a couple of weeks, surely he is behind Hankinson and then where does that leave Worthington.

Rads just seems too nice to refuse a new contract to someone who's been at the club a while. He seems to think they deserve a new deal for sticking around, but its killing our salary cap.

Its depressed me typing this, as yesterday showed we have no strength in depth, but there as so many who didn't even get a look in that still count on the cap.
Again a sensible post,the squad has the depth,in quality of a puddle but as you say is massive.

I know the production line is excellent but not all will make it and some will slip through the net but that’s life.

Mickw
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by Mickw » Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:31 pm

Wire and saints recruitment is proactive ,wigans is reactive simple.

morley pie eater
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by morley pie eater » Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:47 pm

Mickw wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:31 pm
Wire and saints recruitment is proactive ,wigans is reactive simple.
Agree 100%.

On an earlier comment: if we are going to play to Hardaker's strengths, won't that involve having someone to catch the ball for him?

ancientnloyal
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by ancientnloyal » Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:51 pm

You won’t see Warrington or St Helens holding onto sentiment, not now. The last perhaps was getting KC as head coach at Skints (and won a GF)

I wouldn’t be surprised if we announce Sutton come July after his triple leg fracture in the NRL (for example)
Rugby, Family and Strava... that’s about it for me to be honest!

Ellery Hanley our Crown Jewel 💎

TWO EYED WARRIOR
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by TWO EYED WARRIOR » Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:22 pm

For me you have 12 months of issues brewing which are not the fault of Lam but the fault of having a temporary coach.

You had wane who had the club stacked with home grown talent and the coaching set up to make it work and it proved on many occasions that the club could bring in an average player and extract an extra 20-30% out them making them good team players.

Lam is an all together different character, not as intense and only being here for a short time his focus is quite naturally on the 1st team however for his methods to work he will need to bring in the quality players but as has already been stated the roster is bloated and there is little or no room to bring in players.

We have a clash of policies IMO. The clubs policy of developing its own and Lam needing quality quickly is meaning he is hamstrung.

Not a good situation to be in and i fear a fire sale just to make room on the cap to bring some players in to rescue the season

I certainly hope i am wrong

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Wigan_forever1985
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by Wigan_forever1985 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:25 pm

This does rign a lot of bells of when we got into a big mess remember that phase we went through signing dross payers Wilkes, Jordan James, Botham, Millard, Withers, Mcavoy, Orr etc etc
Always be yourself - unless you can be Dan Bilzerian then ALWAYS be Dan Bilzerian!

DaveO
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Re: Let’s Start A Proper Debate

Post by DaveO » Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:56 pm

First Try Tickle wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:49 am
I do think the problem is Wigan don't seem to want to release anyone, and if they show anything they get new contract. We wonder why we cant seem to compete with the signing of Warrington and Saints, but we have so many players who just will not make it.

In Woods, Shorrocks and Ganson, we have 3 players all re-signed. But unless we have a major injury problem, I can't see any of them getting a game, and they have been here too long to break through. There are younger players who will be ahead of them soon so they need to be released. How long are we going to stick with Forsyth and Wells, both had a run in the team, but I can't see them getting back in. Forsyth is 23 in a couple of weeks, surely he is behind Hankinson and then where does that leave Worthington.

Rads just seems too nice to refuse a new contract to someone who's been at the club a while. He seems to think they deserve a new deal for sticking around, but its killing our salary cap.

Its depressed me typing this, as yesterday showed we have no strength in depth, but there as so many who didn't even get a look in that still count on the cap.
I think you are right about keeping too many players. The system means if you do your salary cap is spread too thin.

If you add to that players like Isa, Powell and Navarette all being given quite long contracts you have to wonder about the sanity of Rads and IL doing this. Are they blind to the obvious limitations of these players? The usual argument is we can't have a team of superstars but Powell in particular occupies a position you can't afford to have a poor player in.

With both Lockers and TL now at the end of their careers why have we not got replacements lined up? It's as if Rads doesn't know where to look so they have given them deals because they kind find anyone else.

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