Marshall

Discuss all things Wigan Warriors. Comments and opinions on all aspects of the club's performance are welcome.
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shaunedwardsfanclub
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Marshall

Post by shaunedwardsfanclub » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:57 am

Possible ACL!
Winning is down to 99% perspiration and 1% inspiration - Shaun Edwards

moto748
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Re: Marshall

Post by moto748 » Sat Mar 09, 2019 4:14 pm

Oh dear. And for all the talk about 'we've got too many wingers'...

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EagleEyePie
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Re: Marshall

Post by EagleEyePie » Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:38 pm

moto748 wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 4:14 pm
Oh dear. And for all the talk about 'we've got too many wingers'...
To be fair, even with Marshall, Burgess and possibly Manfredi out we still have Davies plus Escare, Mullen, Forsyth and Brown as potential wingers, and Gildart or Sarginson could fill in there.

moto748
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Re: Marshall

Post by moto748 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:08 pm

EagleEyePie wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:38 pm

To be fair, even with Marshall, Burgess and possibly Manfredi out we still have Davies plus Escare, Mullen, Forsyth and Brown as potential wingers, and Gildart or Sarginson could fill in there.
Time to give Mullen another shot on the left wing then? He has never let the side down when he's played before,.

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wall_of_voodoo
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Re: Marshall

Post by wall_of_voodoo » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:12 pm

EagleEyePie wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:38 pm
To be fair, even with Marshall, Burgess and possibly Manfredi out we still have Davies plus Escare, Mullen, Forsyth and Brown as potential wingers, and Gildart or Sarginson could fill in there.
Here we have ladies and gentlemen one of the reason we are struggling with the cap when fans think the likes of Forsyth are anything better than a championship player. Swinton standard and keep him there
I'm a better fan than you
Because I don't "Boo"!!!

We never lose any games
We just don't win them (always the refs fault anyway)

pedro
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Re: Marshall

Post by pedro » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:42 pm

he cant cut it there
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1857407490.png

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EagleEyePie
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Re: Marshall

Post by EagleEyePie » Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:00 pm

wall_of_voodoo wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:12 pm
EagleEyePie wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:38 pm
To be fair, even with Marshall, Burgess and possibly Manfredi out we still have Davies plus Escare, Mullen, Forsyth and Brown as potential wingers, and Gildart or Sarginson could fill in there.
Here we have ladies and gentlemen one of the reason we are struggling with the cap when fans think the likes of Forsyth are anything better than a championship player. Swinton standard and keep him there
You think fans are responsible for salary cap management?

Also, 'Swinton standard' is probably what you'd expect for someone who is 6th, maybe 7th choice winger (and 4th choice centre). Mind you, on form he's better than Hankinson.

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wall_of_voodoo
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Re: Marshall

Post by wall_of_voodoo » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:07 pm

EagleEyePie wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:00 pm
wall_of_voodoo wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:12 pm


Here we have ladies and gentlemen one of the reason we are struggling with the cap when fans think the likes of Forsyth are anything better than a championship player. Swinton standard and keep him there
You think fans are responsible for salary cap management?

Also, 'Swinton standard' is probably what you'd expect for someone who is 6th, maybe 7th choice winger (and 4th choice centre). Mind you, on form he's better than Hankinson.

Where did I post that fans are directly responsible for the salary cap mismanagement?, That will always be the owners responsibility and you know that as well as I do.

What I am saying is that when someone thinks the likes of Forsyth and Brown are good enough to be on the wing for Wigan, then you are accepting the mediocre players who give cameo appearances once or twice a season justification to them being kept on. Which the owner does.
EagleEyePie wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:38 pm
we still have Forsyth and Brown as potential wingers
Your words not mine!

We then have the current scenario were half our squad is out on dual reg or loan and we haven't the ability to recruit top quality players due to the club being at the cap limit. Are you happy with that?

Escare is not a winger either as you will be aware if you watch the team, so using the square peg into round hole approach to player selection is pathetic. Where you one of those suggesting Escare as a halfback just to get him into the team?

Wing is a specialist position and their is palpable difference between someone "filling in" and a real genuine winger. So if Marshall/Manfredi and Burgess are out that leaves us only Davies as the current first team experienced winger with about 20 players fans can suggest as "filling in"

Now I don't care 6th or nth choice. Fact is our squad is over burgeoning with players that should not be kept on for the simple reason of a non-existent reserve league. We need quality not quantity and the team as it currently performs reflects that lack

As for Hankinson, He has played 3 games for Swinton since his eye injury ruled him out last season. Is he good enough? Probably not, time will tell if he is another cheap recruit but the caveat is that Forsyth has been at Wigan a lot longer without showing any glimpse to suggest he should get a chance in the first team
I'm a better fan than you
Because I don't "Boo"!!!

We never lose any games
We just don't win them (always the refs fault anyway)

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EagleEyePie
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Re: Marshall

Post by EagleEyePie » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:44 pm

wall_of_voodoo wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:07 pm
Where did I post that fans are directly responsible for the salary cap mismanagement?, That will always be the owners responsibility and you know that as well as I do.

What I am saying is that when someone thinks the likes of Forsyth and Brown are good enough to be on the wing for Wigan, then you are accepting the mediocre players who give cameo appearances once or twice a season justification to them being kept on. Which the owner does.

Your words not mine!

We then have the current scenario were half our squad is out on dual reg or loan and we haven't the ability to recruit top quality players due to the club being at the cap limit. Are you happy with that?

Escare is not a winger either as you will be aware if you watch the team, so using the square peg into round hole approach to player selection is pathetic. Where you one of those suggesting Escare as a halfback just to get him into the team?

Wing is a specialist position and their is palpable difference between someone "filling in" and a real genuine winger. So if Marshall/Manfredi and Burgess are out that leaves us only Davies as the current first team experienced winger with about 20 players fans can suggest as "filling in"

Now I don't care 6th or nth choice. Fact is our squad is over burgeoning with players that should not be kept on for the simple reason of a non-existent reserve league. We need quality not quantity and the team as it currently performs reflects that lack

As for Hankinson, He has played 3 games for Swinton since his eye injury ruled him out last season. Is he good enough? Probably not, time will tell if he is another cheap recruit but the caveat is that Forsyth has been at Wigan a lot longer without showing any glimpse to suggest he should get a chance in the first team
I think you're misunderstanding the cap. Most of the players we have in 'reserve' wont count on the salary cap unless they play a game, so there can be benefits in keeping hold of promising young players who no longer qualify for the Under 19's and then loaning them out or sending them on dual registration. If they are loaned out, they don't count on the cap, whether they are among the top 25 earners or not. So players like Josh Woods, Caine Barnes, Samy Kibula, James Worthington, Callum Field etc aren't counting towards the salary cap and won't unless they play a first team game. Clearly there's not as much leeway as some people think as playing these type of fringe players is what led the club to request cap dispensation in 2017.

Also, I'm not sure why you're dismissing Brown as mediocre since he was one of the top performers in the under 19's last year. He's a promising winger who probably would have been given a first team chance at any other club but we happen to have 4 Super League standard wingers already. Marshall and Davies were in the same position at the same stage in their career.

You say wing is a specialist position and I agree, but only to the extent that every position in the game is a specialist position. Which ones aren't? We won a Super League title with Darrell Goulding on the wing one year, and he was neither quick, nor strong, nor tall, nor pretty much anything you'd expect of a winger. It's the one position where you can probably get away with playing someone who has one or two weakness (just like at Marshall as a prime example).

While I do agree that the squad is carrying too many players who realistically won't be good enough (Field, Worthington, Shorrocks and realistically we only need one out of Hankinson and Forsyth) I'd say the bulk of our cap issues revolve around having 4 wingers who will be on wages you'd expect of good SL wingers, players like Powell, Clubb, Isa, Tautai who have had renewed contracts and are considered 'key' players despite never actually playing at that level.

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