Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

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DaveO
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by DaveO » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:00 am

nathan_rugby wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:48 am
Wigan_forever1985 wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:08 am
josie andrews wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:40 am


Castleford have been on the most I think this season 🤨 think somebody quoted 11 times in the first 14 rounds or something like that!
The Hull KR vs Leeds game meant more 3 weeks ago than it does now as leeds are looking like they have actually got their act together

I said it in another thread though this for me is the reason the playoffs dont work because coming into the last part of the season when it should be the crescendo of performances it just isnt the top 5 teams just need to keep ticking over and no one is actually interested in coming 1st in the league.

So the interest now is lying with the relegation battle, but you would double the interest if the battle at the top was for 1 single place not 5.

We have to get rid of the play offs IMO
I think the problem with the play-offs is that it does generate a lot more hype than the regular season and I suspect the clubs make a lot of money from it and Sky get a lot of viewers.
Are the crowds significantly bigger than regular league fixtures and if they are, do they make up for potentially lower gates during the rest of the season?

This is the first season of the new system and we have played Salford three times already. Will people want to watch the same team three times going forward or will they start skipping fixtures particularly the away repeat fixtures?
It needs to be cut down though IMO. First should be rewarded by going straight to the final. The winner of 3rd vs 4th should play 2nd place for the last place in the final. One of the issues I had over the years, althoguh that may now have gone since we operate a top 5 rather than top 8 is that teams can qualify with negative points difference and lose more than they have won.
I think that is worse than the top five system The team finishing top can still lose its first playoff game in the top 5 system and gets another chance to reach the final, playing at home . In your system their entire season is reduced to a one off game - the final. May as well say play 26 games and then play 1st v 2nd for all the difference it makes.

The top five ought to make the competition more intense as there is value finishing higher up the league but the problem with any playoff system is the more you bias it towards the top team giving them the advantage making it less likely a team from lower down wins it, the more it appears to be a waste of time. When you go the other way and widen the playoff competition, as you say you get teams qualifying who have lost more games than they have won and the main season is well and truly devalued.

There are two reasons to have playoffs. First to deal with the fact there is an irregular fixture list with not all teams playing each other an equal number of times. Secondly to keep interest for teams who would otherwise at various points of the season get to the position of not being able to win the league (though why that is a problem in itself I really don't know - do better next year and enjoy the remaining games for what they are).

Both issues are easily solved in my opinion by reverting to a home and away fixture list and reintroducing a cup competition like the old Regal Trophy for extra fixtures to generate revenue. A league cup for RL which is timed along with the challenge cup to make it possible for teams to be involved in pursuit of a trophy for most of the season. To make it a worthwhile competition add substantial prize money.

Despite having had the playoffs for a number of years now and even though RL had them in the past, I still think they are alien to the British sporting public and not universally liked.

When we went to a GF it was solving a problem that didn't exist. The CC was still packed out at Wembley so the sport had its big occasion, we had the regal trophy and the Premiership for teams who were not going to win the league. The way the RFL went about trashing the value of the league by not even offering a trophy and effectively setting up a rival to the CC thus trashing its own high visibility showpiece, all to promote the GF, was just commercial and sporting vandalism but typical of those running the game at the time.

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Wigan_forever1985
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by Wigan_forever1985 » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:10 am

I think rugby league needs to wise up and stop pretending its bigger than it is, spreading itself thin has left the sport in dire straights

I agree with whats been said around the fact some teams end up playing 4-5 times in a season and its ludicrous.

For me to save Rugby League we need to simplify it - 1 set of home and away games the winner of the league is the winner of the league. Like DaveO said the fact a team in 5-6th has nothing to play for towards the end should not be a factor - lets not turn this into everyone gets a prize sports day because all you do is take worth out of the main prize. Season tickets would mean you are seeing all the action you should be seeing, not the pre-season before the important games.

Id keep magic but id have it as a 7's tournament so its not a full fixture
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Firestarter
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by Firestarter » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:44 am

Wigan_forever1985 wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:10 am
I think rugby league needs to wise up and stop pretending its bigger than it is, spreading itself thin has left the sport in dire straights

I agree with whats been said around the fact some teams end up playing 4-5 times in a season and its ludicrous.

For me to save Rugby League we need to simplify it - 1 set of home and away games the winner of the league is the winner of the league. Like DaveO said the fact a team in 5-6th has nothing to play for towards the end should not be a factor - lets not turn this into everyone gets a prize sports day because all you do is take worth out of the main prize. Season tickets would mean you are seeing all the action you should be seeing, not the pre-season before the important games.

Id keep magic but id have it as a 7's tournament so its not a full fixture
i really like the idea of a magic sevens tournament WF...... just the one day tournament...... have a wooden spoon type cup as well( for allthe teams that get knocked out early)......keeps all the fans in the stadium interested..... great idea imo
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DaveO
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by DaveO » Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:25 am

Or you could make the Magic Weekend a round of the Challenge Cup or the Regal Trophy equivalent if that were reintroduced.

ancientnloyal
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by ancientnloyal » Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:00 pm

Sky will notice the drop in figures. It won’t happen again.
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by ancientnloyal » Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:04 pm

Also a game like Wigan saints will have build up on Sky sports News all week... little things I know but I’ve yet to see any build up for SL for this weekend (not that I’ve been actively looking) but it is more noticeable
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by josie andrews » Wed Jul 10, 2019 1:00 pm

Super League: St Helens v Wigan Warriors

Leaders St Helens welcome back both their specialist hookers, including England and Great Britain international James Roby, for Friday's derby.

Aaron Smith also returns, with calf injury absentee Joseph Paulo and Matty Costello missing out.

Wigan make just one change, with full-back Morgan Escare replaced by half-back Jake Shorrocks.

Adrian Lam's side have won their past five Super League games, but have lost both derbies to St Helens in 2019.

Saints have only lost two games this season, at Catalans Dragons and away to London Broncos, and their home ground has been a fortress.

Their sensational form has seen them open up an eight-point lead at the top of the Super League table, but Wigan are among the form teams in the competition and their winning run has propelled them into the top four.

The game comes just days after Lam was given the Wigan job on a longer-term basis, agreeing a one-year contract extension.

St Helens (from): Lomax, Makinson, Naiqama, Percival, Grace, Fages, Walmsley, Roby, Thompson, McCarthy-Scarsbrook, Knowles, Amor, Peyroux, Swift, Lees, Ashworth, Smith, Bentley, Coote

Wigan (from): Bullock, Burgess, Byrne, Clubb, Farrell, Gildart, Hankinson, Hardaker, Isa, Leuluai, Marshall, Navarrete, Partington, Powell, Sammut, Sarginson, Jake Shorrocks, Smithies, Williams

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/48920102
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Wigan_forever1985
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by Wigan_forever1985 » Wed Jul 10, 2019 1:39 pm

ancientnloyal wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:04 pm
Also a game like Wigan saints will have build up on Sky sports News all week... little things I know but I’ve yet to see any build up for SL for this weekend (not that I’ve been actively looking) but it is more noticeable
Sky need Broncos to win tomorrow really because without that the Leeds game doesnt have any real significance - yeah leeds would be back with the relegation pack if they lose but if london start to get cut loose it reduces the peril.
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Nezza Faz
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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by Nezza Faz » Wed Jul 10, 2019 7:05 pm

But Hull KR and Huddersfield would also be in the relegation mix, especially if they both lose this weekend.

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Re: Justin Holbrook and Adrian Lam hit out at decision not to screen St Helens vs Wigan

Post by Wigan_forever1985 » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:43 pm

Nezza Faz wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 7:05 pm
But Hull KR and Huddersfield would also be in the relegation mix, especially if they both lose this weekend.
The draw of the match though was presumably the idea Leeds we’re in peril

No offence to Hull kr or hudda but no one car their supporters care about them going down but Leeds going down would be like when we lost Bradford which was unthinkable at the time

As much as I love to see Leeds in trouble super league needs them I’d be happy to see them survive
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