Wigan v wakey

Discuss all things Wigan Warriors. Comments and opinions on all aspects of the club's performance are welcome.
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EagleEyePie
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by EagleEyePie »

Fan4Fifty wrote: Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:27 pm Just going back to the topic, for me the most difficult aspect of the Wakey performance, particularly in the second half, was the succession of one-man drives even at the end of sets when we were within 30 metres of their line. So reminiscent of the pre-lockdown Salford game. I want to be positive but we don't seem to have a Plan-B and a pack with Smithies, Havard, Byrne still doesn't have the physical presence to dominate bigger and more mature forwards yet. Especially when our bigger, more mature forwards, Faz and maybe Bullock (for a time) excepted on Sunday are not really cutting it. And despite some nice touches, surely we should be using Hastings better than as a drop-off pass giver to Faz.
I think our pack of forwards is a bit predictable. We've got a lot of hard work and graft but not much in the way of a powerful runner or intelligent ball player. Faz is by far the best we have. Even on a bad day he's making 30-40 tackles with barely any missed and over 100 metres in a game.

What we don't have is back row forward in the mould of Hock, Hoffman or Tomkins. A big presence who can hit gaps and stretch defences but also chuck out an offload. I'm pretty sure the idea was for Greenwood to be that player and when he first arrived he was. Unfortunately it hasn't worked out. Thankfully for next year we're bringing back Bateman, who might not have had the size of the 3 above but definitely troubled the defence in much the same way. For this season though, and indeed last, we don't quite have that threat with Isa. He's not really a smart offloader or strong runner. He's a solid 7/10 player most games but when he gets the ball I don't think any defender is expecting anything other than a hard run at them. I'm not sure we'd get anything more from Smithies in that role as he's another grafter. I just think that in particular makes our attack less threatening.

Then when you look at our props, the one player who should be the biggest handful, Burgess, is nothing of the sort right now. Bullock is a hard runner. Havard a quality player but only 19. Then we've got a lot of players whose strength is mainly their defence - Partington, Flower, Clark, Clubb. Byrne offers more in attack but is also very much head down and drive, make as many carries as he can.

I doubt many teams could match our forwards in terms of their commitment to the defensive side of the game. I just think we lack that consistent threat that will keep defenders occupied down the middle and open up space, or a player with a good offload that can hold the defenders in the tackle for just a little bit longer. If Burgess was up to speed he could easily be that sort of player. Greenwood in the form when he first arrived would also make a massive difference, while Bullock at his potential could be a real threat. If those 3 players were playing as well as they could do then not many teams would fancy their chances against us. Ultimately that's not quite happened as intended.
Gerrumonside
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by Gerrumonside »

Yeah and think we’re also missing our physical big ball playing loose forward popping up here and there and distributing or leading in attack, whether that be dare I say it lockers from a few years ago and for quite a stint to Farrell before him - looks like a pack in transition?
morley pie eater
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by morley pie eater »

Wigan_forever1985 wrote:
I dont think simply raising the cap will help the game - because the game itself doesnt have much of a draw therefore raising the cap will just mean a few mercenary signings for bigger spending teams. I do think the cap needs to be raised and tweaked but i dont think its the issue below are probably my big takes

Poster boy needed:
I probably sound like a broken record but the closest RL ever came to breaking out of its niche status was Sam Tomkins 2012 - he was everywhere footballers were talking to him, he was on question of sport, bradley wiggins was in adverts with him and he played for the barbarians. You cannot grow the sport without a poster Boy/Girl - F1 - Hamilton, Boxing - Fury/Joshua, Snooker - Ronnie, Golf - Rory Mc etc etc if i say Rugby league outside of the north i bet i cant get a player name out of anyone consistently - sports are built on people not the sport.

Sponsors:
Which leads to my second point the reason these players are never out there is because there is no financial gain for them to be there they cant have sponsor deals and sell their face, its imperative to increase exposure that this rule changes

League:
Trim it, dont expand it, go to 10 teams of real quality not 12-14 teams 2 of which arent even based in the country. Compact it and grow in hotspots like cumbria who actually want the game. people can bang on about the salary cap levelling the playing field etc but since superleague started only 4 teams have ever won it and 1 of those hasnt even played in the league for 6 years.

League Structure:
Personally i think youd get far more fans in with a straight league, do away with all the playoff non-sense if you want to make every game count - make every game count. People like simplicity in sports not convoluted play off systems - thats the american market and they are used to it, this game isnt being played in america its being played in the uk. I know it works for the NRL but that doesnt mean it has to work for us. Let the best team be the ones who win the most games if you want a big night out in manc then do something else for that

Thats my ramblings anyway
I've been saying we should have 10 teams for years.

Play each other 3 times giving 27 games. Improved quality. More money per team. A more realistic Championship too - possibly also 10 teams, around the standard of Fev, London, Halifax, Leigh etc.

All Superleague teams to have youth development structures to approved standards. For years Wigan and Leeds have set the benchmark - possibly Saints, Wire, Hull to a lesser extent. We can't sign Union converts any more, and are too reliant on Southern hemisphere signings.

We need a root and branch review and a clear plan, but won't get it because of club's self interest. Sadly, I see us being back to semi-pro standard as things stand.
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Firestarter
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by Firestarter »

I think greenwood needs another go...... hes a danger close to the try line, especially on the left edge
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Barney841
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by Barney841 »

Firestarter wrote: Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:23 am I think greenwood needs another go...... hes a danger close to the try line, especially on the left edge
I agree. He should be ahead of Isa. All Isa offers is work rate, Greenwood has a good offload and causes trouble for defences. He’s just got to have a good run without any injuries
Southern Softy
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by Southern Softy »

Sadly (and I may be wrong) I get the feeling that the coach doesn't rate him and it seems that if that happens, whatever you do, you won't get back in. I'd give him that right side second-row - Faz is a left-side second-row and didn't look happy when he was tried there before. Having said that - when Bateman comes back, you'd assume he'd slot in there although knowing our coaching - he'll probably be at hooker or full-back!
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Mike
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by Mike »

Was anyone actually watching his last few performances? He may have been the things you say he is when he first joined, but he was a shadow of that for months before his loan deal. He has to prove he's back in training at least before jumping back in the side.
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Barney841
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by Barney841 »

Don’t know what’s happen to greenwood. He played really well under Wane, scored a good few tries and he’s good at breaking tackles and offloading.
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Mike
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Re: Wigan v wakey

Post by Mike »

Too many head knocks. Lost his confidence.
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