morley pie eater wrote: ↑Sun Sep 05, 2021 9:01 pm
Sorry to disappoint the moaners (or maybe not), but though I was disappointed with the result, I thought it was an encouraging performance.
Increasingly shrill voices have complained about Lam, Powell, Bibby, Partington, Byrne, Smithies, Smith, and others. Now (apparently) Shorrocks is "crap' too! KPP is still in his honeymoon period, but it won't be long before he cops it (2 pens for offside in first half....KPP-PP?).
That was a tough 3rd v 4th game. Steve Price complains about Wire having played 3 games in 11 days, but we've played 4 more than them.
To me, that's a cause for celebration - Well Done to all at the club, especially the players, for an incredible performance in extreme adversity.
Oh, and Sam P did well on his return
define moaners? do you think rather than name calling you might want to consider that some supporters of what is supposedly the biggest Rugby League club in the world might want more than "putting up a good fight"
Im not sure what part of th performance you were encouraged by - we looked completely rudderless again, we failed to provide any threat going forward again andin general we dont look at threat to anyone competing for honours this year
As to you second point about the shrill voices im not sure what youre getting at - yes there has been a lot of complaints about Lam and Powell because neither are good enough for wigan, bibby is questionable i think he had a great start to the year but has fallen off, the young lads you talk about are all not performing, i think the general feeling is that they are being completely overplayed rather than directed at them.
Which bit is cause for celebration? the fact we didnt get battered? is that what constitutes success now? no you cant win them all but we could of won that had we been a better team - Wire werent particularly great today we had chances we werent good enough to take them
Sam P went ok and his assist for the havard try was good but lets not forget his replacement was a forward without absolutely no experience of playing 9 at senior level, so if he isnt a step up on that then im not sure again how low the expectation of one player could be
there is a saying "when you tolerate mediocrity you will get more of it"
And you're entitled to your opinion as I am to mine. I just thought I'd do a bit to balance up the overwhelmingly negative stuff on here.
As to your accusation of "name calling"...come on! If a "moaner" is the worst thing you've been called this week, you're doing well. Maybe you're just moaning about being called a moaner?
In 63 years of watching Wigan I have seen more than one game lost in the last minute but I think yesterday was the first time I saw one lost in the first minute. That was unfortunate but not for the first time this season we only seemed to be on the attack after we tore up whatever plan the team were told to work to. That is down to the coaching staff and much as I believe Lam should have gone after one year he isn't the only coach training the team.
We have been badly hurt by having marquee players for the last two years who through injury have simply not been up to the required standard. Bateman this season has been a pale shadow of the player who left to go to Oz and his shoulder problem needs to be sorted one way or another.
You don't sign for a premiership football team unless you pass a thorough medical. I don't know if Wigan do that for UK signings but they very evidently do not do it for overseas signings, things need to change, at least we should ensure that Gildart goes to Warrington when he returns to the UK.
Regarder une fille en bikini, c'est comme avoir un revolver chargé sur sa table:
Il n'y a rien de mal a ça mais il est difficile de penser à autre chose.
ian.birchall wrote: ↑Mon Sep 06, 2021 8:44 am
In 63 years of watching Wigan I have seen more than one game lost in the last minute but I think yesterday was the first time I saw one lost in the first minute. That was unfortunate but not for the first time this season we only seemed to be on the attack after we tore up whatever plan the team were told to work to. That is down to the coaching staff and much as I believe Lam should have gone after one year he isn't the only coach training the team.
We have been badly hurt by having marquee players for the last two years who through injury have simply not been up to the required standard. Bateman this season has been a pale shadow of the player who left to go to Oz and his shoulder problem needs to be sorted one way or another.
You don't sign for a premiership football team unless you pass a thorough medical. I don't know if Wigan do that for UK signings but they very evidently do not do it for overseas signings, things need to change, at least we should ensure that Gildart goes to Warrington when he returns to the UK.
I hate to say I told you so, but I did post this at the time we bought him.
His style, physical stature etc just didn't lend itself to signing someone who was unproven after 2 shoulder ops.
On the bright side, I wasn't overly disappointed with the performance yesterday. With a creative half, we would have won the game (albeit against a tired looking Warrington side).
mickali1 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 05, 2021 7:26 pm
I actually think we will be a better team without Hastings. That isn't to say he's a bad player, he's obviously not, but I don't see that he brings any cohesion to the team. He would be better suited to a team with more experienced players leaving him free to do his own thing. We need more of a team player who can guide the players around the pitch; better utilise the players around him; bring on Smith and ideally kick intelligently. A high percentage rate for conversions would be useful as well. Not too much to ask for is it??
Re Hastings. I think he has got to the stage of believing (probably correctly) that if he doesn't create something then nobody will.
Was it a better performance? Certainly was.
Did we ever look like winning? Certainly didn't.
Did Powell's return make a difference? Yes but it made us return to our old ways - slow across the field so that by the time we reached one side of the pitch, there was no room to run and the attack ground to a halt.
It was pretty much every match we have played this year repeated in attack although generally, our defence was better, certainly in Warrington's half.
mickali1 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 05, 2021 7:26 pm
I actually think we will be a better team without Hastings. That isn't to say he's a bad player, he's obviously not, but I don't see that he brings any cohesion to the team. He would be better suited to a team with more experienced players leaving him free to do his own thing. We need more of a team player who can guide the players around the pitch; better utilise the players around him; bring on Smith and ideally kick intelligently. A high percentage rate for conversions would be useful as well. Not too much to ask for is it??
Re Hastings. I think he has got to the stage of believing (probably correctly) that if he doesn't create something then nobody will.
Was it a better performance? Certainly was.
Did we ever look like winning? Certainly didn't. Did Powell's return make a difference? Yes but it made us return to our old ways - slow across the field so that by the time we reached one side of the pitch, there was no room to run and the attack ground to a halt.
It was pretty much every match we have played this year repeated in attack although generally, our defence was better, certainly in Warrington's half.
That isn't fair nor entirely true. There's only so much a hooker can do, the real issue is we do not have good attacking structures, optional runners etc which keeps the defence compact and guessing what will happen. We simply do a catch and pass which means the defence can number up and easily slide across.
To summarise, the issue is creating space. Could Powell do better yes, but its 1/3 of the problem I would say as we need structures around Hastings and Smith so that our Fullback and Centres get the ball in space and create 3 on 2 or 2 on 1 situations.
I don't really want this to be an attack on Sam Powell who is a 100%er and always plays as well as possible but you could argue that Micky Mac's game is a simple catch and pass most of the time. The difference is that he takes the ball at first receiver and whips out a quick pass which gives Catalans options. Powell is a slow passer and often takes a step before he passes giving the defence line more time to move up. Sometimes he dummies one way before continuing which means that the oppo defence has even more time to move up.
I agree that it's not all his fault but he is part of the problem- it's the way he plays and assuming that there is a team plan, he sticks to it. If we're going to carry on with this 'plan' then there have to be variants in the line of attack to try and create something different. If not we'll just have more of the same which was the case yesterday.
That’s Powell to a tee though isn’t it - there might be a half decent player in there but he is so painfully slow it just completely stifles the attack
So he may have the right idea sometimes but by the time he’s executed it the moments gone
He’s a modern day Shane Millard
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure
On the whole i thought it was a decent game.
They had obviously tried to increase the intensity and for me it worked most of the time.
KPP is going to be a great player, if he already isnt, Hardaker was doing things that we havent seen all season.
A couple of gripes though, why do we never challenge for kicks? A genuine question, is it a tactic to let the other team catch the ball unchallenged so we have a set defense rather than challenge and someone from the opposition make a break?
Our defense is decent generally but one thing that stands out to me is that unless near the opponents line, our defensive line never moves up quickly and thats where a lot of the opposition meters come from.
But again i thought it was decent, just easier to remember the bits that annoy
Wigan_forever1985 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 06, 2021 12:01 pm
That’s Powell to a tee though isn’t it - there might be a half decent player in there but he is so painfully slow it just completely stifles the attack
So he may have the right idea sometimes but by the time he’s executed it the moments gone
ian.birchall wrote: ↑Mon Sep 06, 2021 8:44 am
In 63 years of watching Wigan I have seen more than one game lost in the last minute but I think yesterday was the first time I saw one lost in the first minute. That was unfortunate but not for the first time this season we only seemed to be on the attack after we tore up whatever plan the team were told to work to. That is down to the coaching staff and much as I believe Lam should have gone after one year he isn't the only coach training the team.
We have been badly hurt by having marquee players for the last two years who through injury have simply not been up to the required standard. Bateman this season has been a pale shadow of the player who left to go to Oz and his shoulder problem needs to be sorted one way or another.
You don't sign for a premiership football team unless you pass a thorough medical. I don't know if Wigan do that for UK signings but they very evidently do not do it for overseas signings, things need to change, at least we should ensure that Gildart goes to Warrington when he returns to the UK.
I hate to say I told you so, but I did post this at the time we bought him.
His style, physical stature etc just didn't lend itself to signing someone who was unproven after 2 shoulder ops.
On the bright side, I wasn't overly disappointed with the performance yesterday. With a creative half, we would have won the game (albeit against a tired looking Warrington side).
Sorry but Smith has to step up or be shipped out.
Creative halves need runners and players who will support. We do neither. Hastings is a MOS standard half and he is also not able to break down defences.
