Batemans's departure confirmed

Discuss all things Wigan Warriors. Comments and opinions on all aspects of the club's performance are welcome.
Charriots Offiah
Posts: 2900
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:14 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by Charriots Offiah »

Barney841 wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:18 pm
medlocke wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 8:24 pm
Charriots Offiah wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 8:20 pm

Losing Nicholson was criminal.
Why?, If he was good enough we would of kept him regardless of what Bateman was or wasn't doing
Didn’t we offer him a new deal but the Wolves offered a better one?
I’m sure someone said that on here when he left
We didn’t offer him a deal.
Charriots Offiah
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Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:14 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by Charriots Offiah »

medlocke wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 8:24 pm
Charriots Offiah wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 8:20 pm
Barney841 wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 7:51 pm

I would of rather had kept McDonnell and Nicholson, to see how they when this upcoming season
Losing Nicholson was criminal.
Why?, If he was good enough we would of kept him regardless of what Bateman was or wasn't doing
Because the lad is a good player and, if he stays injury free he will become a top player.
Charriots Offiah
Posts: 2900
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:14 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by Charriots Offiah »

fozzieskem wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 11:17 pm
medlocke wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:33 pm
Barney841 wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:18 pm

Didn’t we offer him a new deal but the Wolves offered a better one?
I’m sure someone said that on here when he left
Maybe so but if he was seen as being the future of the club surely we would have upped the offer
That he’s not here I’d suspect he wasn’t seen as the next messiah by the club it seems to me.
Peet was extremely upset that he was allowed to leave.
WarriorWinger
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Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2019 4:32 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by WarriorWinger »

nathan_rugby wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 10:41 am
WarriorWinger wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 12:56 pm

Availability is likely to be the biggest obstacle. My view is that Wigan should not have agreed to Bateman’s transfer until a suitable replacement was in place. As the season unfolds there is no doubt that players will become available however, it doesn’t necessarily mean that the right person will be available.
We don't and can't always replace a player by signing a player, otherwise we would never bring any of the young lads through.

Also the club can't sign a player without the conclusion of the exiting player, what could they possibly say to any potential replacement we may sign you but then again if the other deal falls through we won't, you are not going to get anybody on that kind of basis, in the circumstances I think the club have handled this the best way they possibly could.

We have KPP for a year in his preferred position, Isa who can do a job albeit not as good as Bateman, but with an out and out centre at the side of him it should not leave him too exposed in defence (apart from the obvious shooting the line that he does but that could be due to not having confidence in his centre previously), we have some talent coming through the ranks with the young lads who will have a year to dip in and out of the first team for experience, if come towards the back end of the season the club don't feel they will develop enough to be a first team regular in 2024 then they can look to recruit
They really haven’t.

They’ve let a contracted player leave with no replacement lined up in an area of the pitch we have limited cover.

Contracts clearly worth nothing at Wigan which is why we can never seem to build teams and keep players locked down.
And until the 'contracted' player makes his mind up about what he wants to do the club can't sign another player without either going back on the deal with the 'incoming' player if Bateman had changed his mind or the Aussies wouldn't pay what Wigan wanted, or end up with two players eating up cap space, the alternative is wait until last minute and panic buy, but why do that when we have the position covered for the year at least and possibly beyond if the young lads take a step up.
Charriots Offiah
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Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:14 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by Charriots Offiah »

WarriorWinger wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 9:27 am
nathan_rugby wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 10:41 am
WarriorWinger wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 12:56 pm

We don't and can't always replace a player by signing a player, otherwise we would never bring any of the young lads through.

Also the club can't sign a player without the conclusion of the exiting player, what could they possibly say to any potential replacement we may sign you but then again if the other deal falls through we won't, you are not going to get anybody on that kind of basis, in the circumstances I think the club have handled this the best way they possibly could.

We have KPP for a year in his preferred position, Isa who can do a job albeit not as good as Bateman, but with an out and out centre at the side of him it should not leave him too exposed in defence (apart from the obvious shooting the line that he does but that could be due to not having confidence in his centre previously), we have some talent coming through the ranks with the young lads who will have a year to dip in and out of the first team for experience, if come towards the back end of the season the club don't feel they will develop enough to be a first team regular in 2024 then they can look to recruit
They really haven’t.

They’ve let a contracted player leave with no replacement lined up in an area of the pitch we have limited cover.

Contracts clearly worth nothing at Wigan which is why we can never seem to build teams and keep players locked down.
And until the 'contracted' player makes his mind up about what he wants to do the club can't sign another player without either going back on the deal with the 'incoming' player if Bateman had changed his mind or the Aussies wouldn't pay what Wigan wanted, or end up with two players eating up cap space, the alternative is wait until last minute and panic buy, but why do that when we have the position covered for the year at least and possibly beyond if the young lads take a step up.
No. The club should take charge of matters and if need be dismiss the offer or put a deadline on negotiations. We just roll over!
Flash
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Joined: Sat Apr 06, 2019 10:45 am

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by Flash »

Charriots Offiah wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:00 am

No. The club should take charge of matters and if need be dismiss the offer or put a deadline on negotiations. We just roll over!
Which is exactly what we did with Hardaker and KPP. One didn't work out and we ended up with a disgruntled player on our hands that ultimately disrupted the team anyway, the other may or may not work out. It may do or it may end up as another Brian Carney type situation where they end up 'seeing out their contract'. We have yet to find out.

Ultimately it all comes down to the individual player. Bateman, I would suggest, would fall into the 'more trouble than he's worth' category if he didn't want to be here. Maybe the club think so too and have acted accordingly.
WarriorWinger
Posts: 112
Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2019 4:32 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by WarriorWinger »

Flash wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:20 am
Charriots Offiah wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:00 am

No. The club should take charge of matters and if need be dismiss the offer or put a deadline on negotiations. We just roll over!
Which is exactly what we did with Hardaker and KPP. One didn't work out and we ended up with a disgruntled player on our hands that ultimately disrupted the team anyway, the other may or may not work out. It may do or it may end up as another Brian Carney type situation where they end up 'seeing out their contract'. We have yet to find out.

Ultimately it all comes down to the individual player. Bateman, I would suggest, would fall into the 'more trouble than he's worth' category if he didn't want to be here. Maybe the club think so too and have acted accordingly.
As Flash says, we could have done that and had a player coasting seeing his contract out costing the club a small fortune.

Put it another way, outside of sport, an employee in an open work place tells his boss he is looking for another job, what does the boss do, does he hire someone for the same position just in case he ends up leaving or does he wait until he actually hands his notice in, he waits but also looks within the business if he can potentially recruit from within/promote to fill the post, even as a temporary stop gap until he can recruit, with Bateman there is nothing the club could realistically do until pen was put to paper.

In team sport you have that luxury of having a number of people doing the same job at a different level just looking for the opportunity to make it to the top flight, Wigan have a much sought after prospect in KPP for a year, back up who will give his all in Isa and a crop of youngsters snapping at players heels to break into the first team squad. Yes it would be great to just sign a like for like all the time, but you can't always do that especially with salary cap restrictions but then what prospect do the lads coming through have if you are only ever going to go to the transfer market when a player leaves.
Charriots Offiah
Posts: 2900
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:14 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by Charriots Offiah »

Flash wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:20 am
Charriots Offiah wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:00 am

No. The club should take charge of matters and if need be dismiss the offer or put a deadline on negotiations. We just roll over!
Which is exactly what we did with Hardaker and KPP. One didn't work out and we ended up with a disgruntled player on our hands that ultimately disrupted the team anyway, the other may or may not work out. It may do or it may end up as another Brian Carney type situation where they end up 'seeing out their contract'. We have yet to find out.

Ultimately it all comes down to the individual player. Bateman, I would suggest, would fall into the 'more trouble than he's worth' category if he didn't want to be here. Maybe the club think so too and have acted accordingly.
They are making a rod for their own back, which other club constantly finds itself in this position.
Charriots Offiah
Posts: 2900
Joined: Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:14 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by Charriots Offiah »

WarriorWinger wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 1:02 pm
Flash wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:20 am
Charriots Offiah wrote: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:00 am

No. The club should take charge of matters and if need be dismiss the offer or put a deadline on negotiations. We just roll over!
Which is exactly what we did with Hardaker and KPP. One didn't work out and we ended up with a disgruntled player on our hands that ultimately disrupted the team anyway, the other may or may not work out. It may do or it may end up as another Brian Carney type situation where they end up 'seeing out their contract'. We have yet to find out.

Ultimately it all comes down to the individual player. Bateman, I would suggest, would fall into the 'more trouble than he's worth' category if he didn't want to be here. Maybe the club think so too and have acted accordingly.
As Flash says, we could have done that and had a player coasting seeing his contract out costing the club a small fortune.

Put it another way, outside of sport, an employee in an open work place tells his boss he is looking for another job, what does the boss do, does he hire someone for the same position just in case he ends up leaving or does he wait until he actually hands his notice in, he waits but also looks within the business if he can potentially recruit from within/promote to fill the post, even as a temporary stop gap until he can recruit, with Bateman there is nothing the club could realistically do until pen was put to paper.

In team sport you have that luxury of having a number of people doing the same job at a different level just looking for the opportunity to make it to the top flight, Wigan have a much sought after prospect in KPP for a year, back up who will give his all in Isa and a crop of youngsters snapping at players heels to break into the first team squad. Yes it would be great to just sign a like for like all the time, but you can't always do that especially with salary cap restrictions but then what prospect do the lads coming through have if you are only ever going to go to the transfer market when a player leaves.
We don’t constantly go into the market. The club needs standards and bending over backwards does not help. I hope your right and KPP/Isa kill it but, my view is that the pack of forwards we have is not good enough to win SL and that for Wigan is not good enough.
w.thomas
Posts: 261
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:57 pm

Re: Batemans's departure confirmed

Post by w.thomas »

Bateman has been nowhere near his best but he’s not been terrible. I’m not worried about KPP not making the yards like Bateman but I think our defence will be a lot weaker down that side, don’t think Isa and KPP are as good in D as Bateman was. Add to that Isa doesn’t do much going forward, good work rate but not enough meters for me. Having said all that I think we will be ok with KPP covering for a year but we definitely should be looking at bringing someone good in unless nsemba turns out to be a world beater. We shall see, doubtful in a season at his age though. I’m cautiously optimistic about next season and looking forward to it starting, I’m even going to the friendly at barrow! Gods country 👀
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