Murdoch Massila

Got a hot rumour from a source inside the club, or just something you heard down the pub? Then what are you waiting for, post it on The Rumour Mill.
shaunedwardsfanclub
Posts: 5764
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:08 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by shaunedwardsfanclub » Thu May 09, 2019 10:41 am

Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
I can understand your view but, if true, it should be declared on the club's salary cap, as defined by the regulations. If it isn't, then it would open the floodgates as teams could get around the rules and exceed the cap by vast amounts.
Winning is down to 99% perspiration and 1% inspiration - Shaun Edwards

Caboosegg
Posts: 1589
Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2014 4:51 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by Caboosegg » Thu May 09, 2019 1:46 pm

shaunedwardsfanclub wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 10:41 am
Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
I can understand your view but, if true, it should be declared on the club's salary cap, as defined by the regulations. If it isn't, then it would open the floodgates as teams could get around the rules and exceed the cap by vast amounts.
Is the funding coming from games? How much more than a average womans first team player is she earning, it could potentially just be warrington bumping up Masarlas wage by paying his wife over the odds, if thats the case then its wrong.

If its not and warrington women earn enough to pay her i have no issue.

Does the womans team have a salary cap?
RL's biggest issue is the constant negativity of its own fans.

support verb [ (ENCOURAGE)

"to agree with and give encouragement to someone or something because you want him, her, or it to succeed"

markill
Posts: 3675
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 4:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by markill » Thu May 09, 2019 1:53 pm

shaunedwardsfanclub wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 10:41 am
Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
I can understand your view but, if true, it should be declared on the club's salary cap, as defined by the regulations. If it isn't, then it would open the floodgates as teams could get around the rules and exceed the cap by vast amounts.
It does open some questions up. Although the rules also state: "The HDPGS shall then determine whether they should be included in a players Salary Cap Value" (HDPGS is the head of competitions and salary cap at RFL, Samantha Allen). So, that means there is some scope for payments to spouses as long as it's declared and has a decision on it before the payments start I guess. So legitimate, agreed payments would be ok.

For example, if Lockers was married to our physio, but our physio was suitably qualified and paid at the market rate, and Wigan declared all this, then I can't see there being an issue. Or, what if one player married another player and they both played for the same club (an even more likely scenario if they put a cap on the Womens teams, as there are already relationships like this about the game), they wouldn't both count as two players would they.

The idea of trying to promote the development of the womens game, and Roxy Mura being a talented and experienced player, may be enough for the RFL to say the money to her is legitimate. She could also have other roles at the club that make up her salary, like community coaching etc. Because doesn't Rachel Thompson have a similar role at Wigan that I assume she is paid something for, even if not as full-time?

Personally, whilst it's an interesting topic, I don't see it as something to get too upset about.
in the world of mules, there are no rules

LATEST PODCAST EPISODE
[url]https://www.spreaker.com/user/superleaguepod[/url]

Nezza Faz
Posts: 1426
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:05 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by Nezza Faz » Thu May 09, 2019 3:56 pm

Agree 100% with above post (markill). Looks like some people trying to make a problem out of the SC when it just doesn't seem an issue.
If someone at the Wolves is willing to pay out of their own pocket, supporting the Women's game, that's their issue and has nothing to do with the Mens game, and should be regarded as a totally separate level of funding.
I'm not aware that when the SC was introduced there was any ingredient that had to cover the womens game, in fact it didn't exist in any organized format at that time, so I don't see now why it should be included.
Simple solution - scrap the cap !

DaveO
Posts: 14264
Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 5:32 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by DaveO » Thu May 09, 2019 6:49 pm

Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
IIf she was being paid by Warrington to work in the office or be a cleaner her wages would count on the cap.

The reason they would is to stop payments made to a players spouse being used to get around the salary cap.

There is no disincentive to run women's teams any more then the salary cap rules are a disincentive to employing cleaners.

DaveO
Posts: 14264
Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 5:32 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by DaveO » Thu May 09, 2019 6:58 pm

markill wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 1:53 pm
shaunedwardsfanclub wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 10:41 am
Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
I can understand your view but, if true, it should be declared on the club's salary cap, as defined by the regulations. If it isn't, then it would open the floodgates as teams could get around the rules and exceed the cap by vast amounts.
It does open some questions up. Although the rules also state: "The HDPGS shall then determine whether they should be included in a players Salary Cap Value" (HDPGS is the head of competitions and salary cap at RFL, Samantha Allen). So, that means there is some scope for payments to spouses as long as it's declared and has a decision on it before the payments start I guess. So legitimate, agreed payments would be ok.

For example, if Lockers was married to our physio, but our physio was suitably qualified and paid at the market rate, and Wigan declared all this, then I can't see there being an issue. Or, what if one player married another player and they both played for the same club (an even more likely scenario if they put a cap on the Womens teams, as there are already relationships like this about the game), they wouldn't both count as two players would they.

The idea of trying to promote the development of the womens game, and Roxy Mura being a talented and experienced player, may be enough for the RFL to say the money to her is legitimate. She could also have other roles at the club that make up her salary, like community coaching etc. Because doesn't Rachel Thompson have a similar role at Wigan that I assume she is paid something for, even if not as full-time?

Personally, whilst it's an interesting topic, I don't see it as something to get too upset about.
Completely disagree. You can't have a situation where paying some women who are married to a clubs player can be paid and it doesn't count on the cap and others where it would. That just leads to accusations of bias.

Why does the fact she plays for the women's RL side make one iota of difference? Given women being paid to play is the exception unlike any who are employed as a regular employee such as physio or cleaner who would obviously be expected to receive a wage, this has deliberate ploy to get around the cap written all over it.

Woody1989
Posts: 125
Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2013 11:16 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by Woody1989 » Thu May 09, 2019 9:26 pm

DaveO wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 6:49 pm
Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
IIf she was being paid by Warrington to work in the office or be a cleaner her wages would count on the cap.

The reason they would is to stop payments made to a players spouse being used to get around the salary cap.

There is no disincentive to run women's teams any more then the salary cap rules are a disincentive to employing cleaners.
What a load of rubbish. So basically if one of the players happens to fall for one of the backroom staff then the clubs spending power is reduced? If that's true then it's ridiculous.

As for using it to get round the salary cap, surely anyone with a functioning brain cell could look at a cleaners salary and deduce if he/she was being paid well over the odds for a cleaner? It's not that difficult.

DaveO
Posts: 14264
Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 5:32 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by DaveO » Thu May 09, 2019 10:05 pm

Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:26 pm
DaveO wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 6:49 pm
Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
IIf she was being paid by Warrington to work in the office or be a cleaner her wages would count on the cap.

The reason they would is to stop payments made to a players spouse being used to get around the salary cap.

There is no disincentive to run women's teams any more then the salary cap rules are a disincentive to employing cleaners.
What a load of rubbish. So basically if one of the players happens to fall for one of the backroom staff then the clubs spending power is reduced? If that's true then it's ridiculous.

As for using it to get round the salary cap, surely anyone with a functioning brain cell could look at a cleaners salary and deduce if he/she was being paid well over the odds for a cleaner? It's not that difficult.
It's not a load of rubbish its in the salary cap rules which are freely available for you to read yourself.

Having a salary cap basically bans you from employing players spouses. It doesn't matter if they are employed as a cleaner or as a women's RL team player.

How much more do you think a women's RL player is going to be paid then a cleaner or anyone else such as someone with an office job?

If a club was worried about being called out for paying a cleaner £40K a year they could just as easily make up some non job in the office. "PR consultant" or whatever. Get her to do a couple of interviews on the clubs TV channel and bob's your uncle.

I have long thought the RFL are incompetent but if you read the salary cap regs as I have done you have to admire how they have closed off every loophole so it begs the question are the Wire using this to get around the salary cap? She is an exception, the only female RL player who is "professional".

shaunedwardsfanclub
Posts: 5764
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:08 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by shaunedwardsfanclub » Thu May 09, 2019 10:35 pm

Caboosegg wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 1:46 pm
shaunedwardsfanclub wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 10:41 am
Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:23 am
I don't see why that should count on Wires cap. She's not playing for the mens team so it makes no sense to include her salary on the mens teams cap.

It would also reduce incentive for clubs to run womens teams as it would reduce the amount they could pay in salary to the mens team. Surely it would be better to give them their own cap?
I can understand your view but, if true, it should be declared on the club's salary cap, as defined by the regulations. If it isn't, then it would open the floodgates as teams could get around the rules and exceed the cap by vast amounts.
Is the funding coming from games? How much more than a average womans first team player is she earning, it could potentially just be warrington bumping up Masarlas wage by paying his wife over the odds, if thats the case then its wrong.

If its not and warrington women earn enough to pay her i have no issue.

Does the womans team have a salary cap?
I believe she is the only woman being paid to play.

They will be making a loss on games.

No they don't have a salary cap.
Winning is down to 99% perspiration and 1% inspiration - Shaun Edwards

shaunedwardsfanclub
Posts: 5764
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:08 pm

Re: Murdoch Massila

Post by shaunedwardsfanclub » Thu May 09, 2019 10:35 pm

DaveO wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 10:05 pm
Woody1989 wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:26 pm
DaveO wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 6:49 pm


IIf she was being paid by Warrington to work in the office or be a cleaner her wages would count on the cap.

The reason they would is to stop payments made to a players spouse being used to get around the salary cap.

There is no disincentive to run women's teams any more then the salary cap rules are a disincentive to employing cleaners.
What a load of rubbish. So basically if one of the players happens to fall for one of the backroom staff then the clubs spending power is reduced? If that's true then it's ridiculous.

As for using it to get round the salary cap, surely anyone with a functioning brain cell could look at a cleaners salary and deduce if he/she was being paid well over the odds for a cleaner? It's not that difficult.
It's not a load of rubbish its in the salary cap rules which are freely available for you to read yourself.

Having a salary cap basically bans you from employing players spouses. It doesn't matter if they are employed as a cleaner or as a women's RL team player.

How much more do you think a women's RL player is going to be paid then a cleaner or anyone else such as someone with an office job?

If a club was worried about being called out for paying a cleaner £40K a year they could just as easily make up some non job in the office. "PR consultant" or whatever. Get her to do a couple of interviews on the clubs TV channel and bob's your uncle.

I have long thought the RFL are incompetent but if you read the salary cap regs as I have done you have to admire how they have closed off every loophole so it begs the question are the Wire using this to get around the salary cap? She is an exception, the only female RL player who is "professional".
Spot-on Dave.
Winning is down to 99% perspiration and 1% inspiration - Shaun Edwards

Post Reply