Bateman

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Dreamteam
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Re: Bateman

Post by Dreamteam »

Wes wrote: Mon Nov 14, 2022 10:02 pm
Dreamteam wrote: Mon Nov 14, 2022 8:38 pm Why have we decided that because John bateman is leaving we can’t let go of a very replaceable prop who does 20 minutes a game. Baffling decisions sometimes
Maybe with a good pre season they may turn him into a good offloading 2nd rower, pure guess btw. 🤷
Would need to lose about 10 kg for that. Weighed 113 kg at rabbits and from watching him there’s he’s 100% put another few on here at minimum. No idea what he was doing in pre season
Wandering Warrior
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Re: Bateman

Post by Wandering Warrior »

Now the World Cup is over let's get the announcement made so we can all move on!
No one person is bigger than the Club, make Batty's intentions clear soon as like now.
When John Byrom plays on snow, he doesn't leave any footprints - Jimmy Armfield
fozzieskem
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Re: Bateman

Post by fozzieskem »

Have to agree thought all of this type of nonsense had gone when Hastings left get it announced and we all can move on.
the pieman
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Re: Bateman

Post by the pieman »

fozzieskem wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:21 am Have to agree thought all of this type of nonsense had gone when Hastings left get it announced and we all can move on.
Being fair i think this has been mostly media talk and Bateman has gotten on with playing for England, so think its slightly different to the Hastings situation, where it just went on for the 2 years he was at Wigan

No doubt, there will be someone else moving to Oz over the next 12 months (enter player of choice here :) ) as we just cant seem to stop the exodus as a club when the Ozzie teams come knocking
nathan_rugby
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Re: Bateman

Post by nathan_rugby »

Wandering Warrior wrote: Sun Nov 20, 2022 8:32 pm Now the World Cup is over let's get the announcement made so we can all move on!
No one person is bigger than the Club, make Batty's intentions clear soon as like now.
It isn’t gives a constant impression that the contracts are always in the players favour and they can just move on and look elsewhere if they’re not happy?

I get it’s probably detrimental to have unhappy players at the club but is our stance and culture actively encouraging players to look for other and better opportunities?

It does feel like it only impacts our club?
Bomhead - "Lockers to prop."
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Wigan_forever1985
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Re: Bateman

Post by Wigan_forever1985 »

nathan_rugby wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 10:40 am
Wandering Warrior wrote: Sun Nov 20, 2022 8:32 pm Now the World Cup is over let's get the announcement made so we can all move on!
No one person is bigger than the Club, make Batty's intentions clear soon as like now.
It isn’t gives a constant impression that the contracts are always in the players favour and they can just move on and look elsewhere if they’re not happy?

I get it’s probably detrimental to have unhappy players at the club but is our stance and culture actively encouraging players to look for other and better opportunities?

It does feel like it only impacts our club?
I dont think it only effects our club but i think there are logical reasons why we are worse effected

If you think of how the aussies view our game (dimly) it stands to reason that they will probably only be looking at the top clubs in England as a basis for recruitment. So instantly that means Us, Saints, Leeds and Wire.

No Wire are out the mix as they dont reallybring anyone through theypoach from others so people going there are either not on NRL radar or cant get a gig there for their chosen position. Leeds have been yo-yo in terms of achievement and performance since they lost the golden generation so again harder for an NRL team to judge a players potential

So realistically that leaves us and saints as the main targets, now outside of the obvious precedent we have set of letting players go without a fight , Saints i feel do 1 key thing a lot better than us. They bring youngsters in at the correct time i.e when there is a slot for them to fill. We tend to hang onto players we know we win need to move on or arent as good as their younger counterpart and that means we create a pool of emerging players with no clear path to the starting 13.

This is why the "first name on the teamsheet" attitude is completely disastrous to a team. Take O'neill for example he comes into the team his form is great he is doing a belting job. As soon as the senior player is available its back to the stands you go, that should of been o'neills position to lose then and for Sam to work his way into the team. Same when we kept making lockers and tommy go round again with no clear phasing out plan.

I feel saints tend to stick with form players well over simply putting their favourites back in and they've known when to move people on like wilkin. With KFC they had Roby getting plenty game time, they know Roby's not got loads left so they bring in luzzick and start spelling Roby they are phasing him out. Wigan would carry on playing him for 80mins come what may until the day he cant play anymore.
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure
fozzieskem
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Re: Bateman

Post by fozzieskem »

the pieman wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:40 am
fozzieskem wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:21 am Have to agree thought all of this type of nonsense had gone when Hastings left get it announced and we all can move on.
Being fair i think this has been mostly media talk and Bateman has gotten on with playing for England, so think its slightly different to the Hastings situation, where it just went on for the 2 years he was at Wigan

No doubt, there will be someone else moving to Oz over the next 12 months (enter player of choice here :) ) as we just cant seem to stop the exodus as a club when the Ozzie teams come knocking
Oh I agree,and perhaps I’m being unfair classing Bateman with Hastings yes very unfair on my part the lads been class in the time with Wigan on the field,but last close season was lovely,no will he won’t he which seems to have plagued Wigan in recent times,even Burgess turned up late didn’t but that’s another story isn’t it.
the pieman
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Re: Bateman

Post by the pieman »

fozzieskem wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 12:06 pm
the pieman wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:40 am
fozzieskem wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:21 am Have to agree thought all of this type of nonsense had gone when Hastings left get it announced and we all can move on.
Being fair i think this has been mostly media talk and Bateman has gotten on with playing for England, so think its slightly different to the Hastings situation, where it just went on for the 2 years he was at Wigan

No doubt, there will be someone else moving to Oz over the next 12 months (enter player of choice here :) ) as we just cant seem to stop the exodus as a club when the Ozzie teams come knocking
Oh I agree,and perhaps I’m being unfair classing Bateman with Hastings yes very unfair on my part the lads been class in the time with Wigan on the field,but last close season was lovely,no will he won’t he which seems to have plagued Wigan in recent times,even Burgess turned up late didn’t but that’s another story isn’t it.
i think we are on the same page though and Wigan_Forever1985 has nailed it, with the difference between us and Saints

we have had a tendency to let players leave early (when contracted) and in recent years have not moved on players that needed moving on quickly enough. i've posted previously that we used to be the masters of it in the late 80's / early 90's. The quality of player we let go, because we had a conveyor belt of talent coming through or signed someone to replace them
fozzieskem
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Re: Bateman

Post by fozzieskem »

the pieman wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 1:50 pm
fozzieskem wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 12:06 pm
the pieman wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:40 am

Being fair i think this has been mostly media talk and Bateman has gotten on with playing for England, so think its slightly different to the Hastings situation, where it just went on for the 2 years he was at Wigan

No doubt, there will be someone else moving to Oz over the next 12 months (enter player of choice here :) ) as we just cant seem to stop the exodus as a club when the Ozzie teams come knocking
Oh I agree,and perhaps I’m being unfair classing Bateman with Hastings yes very unfair on my part the lads been class in the time with Wigan on the field,but last close season was lovely,no will he won’t he which seems to have plagued Wigan in recent times,even Burgess turned up late didn’t but that’s another story isn’t it.
i think we are on the same page though and Wigan_Forever1985 has nailed it, with the difference between us and Saints

we have had a tendency to let players leave early (when contracted) and in recent years have not moved on players that needed moving on quickly enough. i've posted previously that we used to be the masters of it in the late 80's / early 90's. The quality of player we let go, because we had a conveyor belt of talent coming through or signed someone to replace them
Yes I’m lucky enough to remember those days,no player left it seemed to me till his,usually better replacement came in much like as you rightly point out Saints do now,quite how they do I’m not sure but their success tells me they’re doing something right.
morley pie eater
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Re: Bateman

Post by morley pie eater »

The theory of players going to the NRL because they're not getting opportunities here sounds credible, but I'm struggling to thonk who it applies to.

Sam T, Sutton, Bateman, Williams, Budgie . . ????

An alternative hypothesis: Wigan's history of producing top players attracts the best and most ambitious young kids here in their mid teens. This skill and ambition are the very same qualities that draw young players in their early 20s to play in the NRL.
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