Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

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ian.birchall
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Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by ian.birchall » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:33 am

Mike wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:08 pm
medlocke wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:03 pm
Mike wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:24 pm


I could have sworn he repeated said he wouldn't ask the EU for an extension. But he just did.
He did do what you said but then had a u turn when the loophole was found last week and then said he would send a letter
So he is a liar. And he did do a U-turn. His main motivation seems to me to just end Brexit by his deadline in any way he can. How can you trust this guy won't just cancel article 50 so we can move on? He couldn't decide between remain and leave originally, it means nothing to him personally.
Not true Mike. If you read a quality newspaper like the Daily Telegraph and not the Globe and Mail 📰 you would know that he has had serious questions over the EU for at least 5 years before the referendum.
Will Trudeau overcome his difficulties with blacking up and win?
Just as an aside on the Trudeaus' I was in Canada on my (very early!) retirement holiday in September/October 2000 when Pierre Trudeau died and remember the outpouring of grief there which was as great as the hysteria over Dianas' death here. The only time we saw any Mounties in their famous red uniforms as they carried his coffin up the steps into the Cathedral in Montreal.
Last edited by ian.birchall on Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Regarder une fille en bikini, c'est comme avoir un revolver chargé sur sa table:
Il n'y a rien de mal a ça mais il est difficile de penser à autre chose.


Now Europe is just for holidays.

SJ
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Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by SJ » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:43 am

Wandering Warrior wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:42 pm
SJ wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:45 pm
I agree with most of your post Jobo. But On the point concerning another Ref I prefer Medlocke's opinion. I think an Election would be a better option tho. Re Med's post If we have another Ref it should only concern our withdrawal from the EU or an acceptable deal or no deal. Our decision to leave should not be put in jeopardy for

It's like nailing a jelly to the wall ploughing through some of your stuff SJ!
Put your comment after the last quote, simple!?!
WW don't bother reading them then. Simple

Ps
Their's a small reference ambiguity relating to the word "simple"
Can you spot it simple!😜
I don't read them SJ, I realised ages ago that rambling was one of your characteristics, but I'll put that down to an age thing?!
Another reason I don't read them is as I said , the jelly comment.
It's difficult to pick out what's what, a bit like swimming in treacle!!👎😟

[/quote]this post of your's proves your not telling the truth re- reading my post; the difficulty of understanding what you describe has your ability to "pick out what's what" is more to do with your intellect and not being a competent reader than my"rambling ". Judging by some other posts on the above topic I thing my posts are pretty well succinct (pace Dave O's posts which are in biblical terms Gospel sized :lol: )If you check and answer the question asked you will find my characterisation of you in a word. Simple :lol: :c :lol:
Last edited by SJ on Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ian.birchall
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Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by ian.birchall » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:57 am

DaveO wrote:
Thu Oct 17, 2019 5:23 pm
ian.birchall wrote:
Thu Oct 17, 2019 4:53 pm
Mike wrote:
Thu Oct 17, 2019 4:31 pm


You said the whole of the UK gets the same treatment. You used that to dismiss my idea of different regions being treated differently.

Then you said NI could be different with consent. But nowhere else?

I'm pointing out the flaws in your reasoning.
Who really cares. 1.6million people live in NI. 4.3 million in Eire and 5.4 million in Yorkshire. Home rule for Yorkshire?
So you are happy to see the breakup of the UK due to your anti EU obsession? This is the green light for Scottish Independence. So much for the Conservative and Unionist party.

What is even more ridiculous is you have not realised that when it comes to negotiating a Free Trade Agreement with the EU, the EU will call the shots. Your hero Johnson has already agreed that fishing quotas will be on the table so not only the DUP have been thrown under a bus but so have the Brexit supporting fishermen. Something I pointed out would happen pages and pages ago in this thread.

The new withdrawal agreement is exactly the same as May's apart from putting a border down the Irish sea and removes the Level Playing field provision from the agreement and puts it into the free trade agreement which for the EU just kicks that can down the road. That is they will insist on the Level Playing Field rules in the FTA. It's just a big con because the UK will acquiesce when push comes to shove.

As to the border down the Irish Sea, here is what Johnson had to say about that back in Feb:

The draft legal text the commission have published would, if implemented, undermine the UK common market and threaten the constitutional integrity of the UK by creating a customs and regulatory border down the Irish Sea, and no UK prime minster could ever agree to it.
Now Dave you know that being a political geek I would know that
about French fishermen from Boulogne (the largest fishing port in France where they are currently allowed to fish in UK waters upto the 6 mile limit whereas UK fishermen are only allowed to fish upto the 12 mile limit off the French coast).
I confidently expect France and Spain as well as Holland and Denmark to be making a pitch for our fish as the trade treaty negotiations continue which is what my own personal choice would be the hardest of hard Brexits and keeping all our money.
Regarder une fille en bikini, c'est comme avoir un revolver chargé sur sa table:
Il n'y a rien de mal a ça mais il est difficile de penser à autre chose.


Now Europe is just for holidays.

fozzieskem
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Joined: Sat May 14, 2016 10:54 am

Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by fozzieskem » Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:18 pm

ian.birchall wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:33 am
Mike wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:08 pm
medlocke wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:03 pm

He did do what you said but then had a u turn when the loophole was found last week and then said he would send a letter
So he is a liar. And he did do a U-turn. His main motivation seems to me to just end Brexit by his deadline in any way he can. How can you trust this guy won't just cancel article 50 so we can move on? He couldn't decide between remain and leave originally, it means nothing to him personally.
Not true Mike. If you read a quality newspaper like the Daily Telegraph and not the Globe and Mail 📰 you would know that he has had serious questions over the EU for at least 5 years before the referendum.
Will Trudeau overcome his difficulties with blacking up and win?
Just as an aside on the Trudeaus' I was in Canada on my (very early!) retirement holiday in September/October 2000 when Pierre Trudeau died and remember the outpouring of grief there which was as great as the hysteria over Dianas' death here. The only time we saw any Mounties in their famous red uniforms as they carried his coffin up the steps into the Cathedral in Montreal.
I do read The Telegraph and have done for many years,Johnson always blew whichever way the public favoured his column wasn’t the best read in the paper by any means.

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Mike
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Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by Mike » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:18 pm

fozzieskem wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:18 pm
ian.birchall wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:33 am
Mike wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:08 pm


So he is a liar. And he did do a U-turn. His main motivation seems to me to just end Brexit by his deadline in any way he can. How can you trust this guy won't just cancel article 50 so we can move on? He couldn't decide between remain and leave originally, it means nothing to him personally.
Not true Mike. If you read a quality newspaper like the Daily Telegraph and not the Globe and Mail 📰 you would know that he has had serious questions over the EU for at least 5 years before the referendum.
Will Trudeau overcome his difficulties with blacking up and win?
Just as an aside on the Trudeaus' I was in Canada on my (very early!) retirement holiday in September/October 2000 when Pierre Trudeau died and remember the outpouring of grief there which was as great as the hysteria over Dianas' death here. The only time we saw any Mounties in their famous red uniforms as they carried his coffin up the steps into the Cathedral in Montreal.
I do read The Telegraph and have done for many years,Johnson always blew whichever way the public favoured his column wasn’t the best read in the paper by any means.

Serious doubts don't equal a committed leaver. I think he thinks this situation is his fault and he needs to end it - I doubt he cares which way. The only question is whether he will sign the letter revoking article 50! :lol:

Wiganer Ted
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Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by Wiganer Ted » Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:20 pm

Johnson said if he lost his Timetable Bill he would pull the Bill and trigger a General Election.
He lost the vote on his Timetable Bill then neither pulled the Bill nor attempted to trigger a General Election.
Instead he's consulting the EU to try and negotiate the extension date, something he said he would never ever do and die in a ditch first.
Will the new leave with No Deal deadline date be 31st Jan '20, Feb 20th or perhaps some other day.
This really is good fun!

ancientnloyal
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Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by ancientnloyal » Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:23 pm

Nandy rebelled
Jo Platt (my MP) rebelled

Happy! 😃

Leave means leave.
Rugby, Family and Strava... that’s about it for me to be honest!

Ellery Hanley our Crown Jewel 💎

DaveO
Posts: 14446
Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 5:32 pm

Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by DaveO » Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:53 pm

ian.birchall wrote:
DaveO wrote:
Thu Oct 17, 2019 5:23 pm
ian.birchall wrote:
Thu Oct 17, 2019 4:53 pm
Who really cares. 1.6million people live in NI. 4.3 million in Eire and 5.4 million in Yorkshire. Home rule for Yorkshire?
So you are happy to see the breakup of the UK due to your anti EU obsession? This is the green light for Scottish Independence. So much for the Conservative and Unionist party.

What is even more ridiculous is you have not realised that when it comes to negotiating a Free Trade Agreement with the EU, the EU will call the shots. Your hero Johnson has already agreed that fishing quotas will be on the table so not only the DUP have been thrown under a bus but so have the Brexit supporting fishermen. Something I pointed out would happen pages and pages ago in this thread.

The new withdrawal agreement is exactly the same as May's apart from putting a border down the Irish sea and removes the Level Playing field provision from the agreement and puts it into the free trade agreement which for the EU just kicks that can down the road. That is they will insist on the Level Playing Field rules in the FTA. It's just a big con because the UK will acquiesce when push comes to shove.

As to the border down the Irish Sea, here is what Johnson had to say about that back in Feb:

The draft legal text the commission have published would, if implemented, undermine the UK common market and threaten the constitutional integrity of the UK by creating a customs and regulatory border down the Irish Sea, and no UK prime minster could ever agree to it.
Now Dave you know that being a political geek I would know that
about French fishermen from Boulogne (the largest fishing port in France where they are currently allowed to fish in UK waters upto the 6 mile limit whereas UK fishermen are only allowed to fish upto the 12 mile limit off the French coast).
I confidently expect France and Spain as well as Holland and Denmark to be making a pitch for our fish as the trade treaty negotiations continue which is what my own personal choice would be the hardest of hard Brexits and keeping all our money.
So let’s say we get the hardest of hard Brexits. What exactly does that mean for the fishing industry?

Not much from our side. It’s a tiny industry.

If you were such a political geek you’d know the UK offshore fishing industry is a tiny part of our economy. The Scottish part of it, run by a few large trawler owners, contributes less to our GDP than Edinburgh University.

It’s not suddenly going to launching a new fleet. Trawler owners in Grimsby were happy to take seven figure sums off Spanish trawler owners to sell their franchises.

It does however mean a lot to related industries.

The fish processing industry would be killed off. It would face tariffs with your mega hard Brexit. This is why the idiot of a Tory MP in the area suggested places like Grimsby become “free ports” and effectively remain in the EU. As if that will fly when we have just told them to bugger off out of our waters.

Scottish salmon farming would also suddenly attract import tariffs into the EU and again, the EU aren’t going to let that one go if we won’t give some quid pro quo.

I really don’t know what you expect to happen even with your hard Brexit. As soon as we start negotiating a FTA then the government must decide its priorities and its compromises. The fisherman will be thrown under a bus regardless of how hard a Brexit it is because the government isn’t going to disadvantage much larger industries to keep them or people such as yourself happy because they are fixated on the crazy notion our fishing industry is some sort of important talisman all else must give way to.

You seem to live in a fantasy world where your mythical hard Brexit allows us to do things like not negotiate access to our waters for foreign fishing boats and there are no negative consequences.

It’s delusions like this that led to the 2016 result in the first place.


Wintergreen
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Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by Wintergreen » Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:54 pm

Wiganer Ted wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:20 pm
Johnson said if he lost his Timetable Bill he would pull the Bill and trigger a General Election.
He lost the vote on his Timetable Bill then neither pulled the Bill nor attempted to trigger a General Election.
Instead he's consulting the EU to try and negotiate the extension date, something he said he would never ever do and die in a ditch first.
Will the new leave with No Deal deadline date be 31st Jan '20, Feb 20th or perhaps some other day.
This really is good fun!
Johnson is always breaking his word. Frankly I wouldn't believe anything coming out of his mouth (and I am a Conservative by nature).

The only thing I did see was Rees-Mogg (the most annoying person in the UK?) with a face like a smacked arse when the vote came in.

For that reason alone I am happy :D

In terms of the whole process I think I am now at the point where I don't understand anything that is going on.

DaveO
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Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 5:32 pm

Re: Why we will be worse off through Brexit (Question from other forum)

Post by DaveO » Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:54 pm

ancientnloyal wrote:Nandy rebelled
Jo Platt (my MP) rebelled

Happy! Image

Leave means leave.
You really are deluded.

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