browns_babe06 posted:
i personally dont think lockers is a srong enough captain he doesn't have the experience needed as it showed on friday night.
at one point when a decision was being made locker's was just stood there and lulu was dont the talking.
locker's was just facing the other way.
Hence the post too many chiefs. I wish Lockers would put the interests of the club before his own. That doesnt mean i think it is him being stubborn just him trying to prove himself to us doubters.
If the posts are true and Barret is giong to be our "unoficial captain" Lockers must recognise that Barret is a top class player and a true experienced captain.
We have been let down as fans for two years on the run, the club has made the changes to put us back on the road to recovery it isnt complete hence the three year plan but lets get our Aces in places to get the results.
cpwigan posted:
The style might be different but the attitude never is. That is what Lockers brings IMO.
ATTITUDE Dave. I believe he is extremely professional. Very honest and determined. He is also well liked and respected by his teammates.
Dallas was exactly the same but no on ever thought of him as captaincy material. So was Rads and people questioned his ability as captain. There is more too it than that which is why, I assume, this thread exists at all in that Barrett has that something extra to make him the natural leader the players are gravitating to for leadership if the o/p is correct in what he says.
My concern is that if they are doing that, sort of declaring UDI and effectively picking their own captain this leaves Lockers out on a limb as being the captain no one takes any notice of. That isn't a good situation for the club whatever your views on Lockers captaincy are.
Last season it was clear to see that Lockers was captain in name only, he made the odd token gesture to the ref when something went wrong but that was it. It was Orr who was seen to motivate the team behind the sticks more than most, Lockers just stood there time and time again, he never pointed at anyone, he never shouted or showed the players why we had leaked another try. He simple stood there leaving it too others.
So what has changed?
Nothing!
I guess in training Lockers is still stood around quite but instead of the likes of Orr giving the instructions it is now the turn of Barrett.
Lockers can be a good club captain and I think he is happy with that role off the field. I also think he may be a very good captain off the field as far as being an honest player that portrays a clean image and life style. He can be good as a role model.
Wigan Watcher posted:
Totally disagree with you here Dave.
Last season it was clear to see that Lockers was captain in name only,
Now I am totally confused because that is exactly what I am saying Lockers is based on your original post in this thread. If Barrett is being chosen by the players then Lockers is captain in name only.
he made the odd token gesture to the ref when something went wrong but that was it. It was Orr who was seen to motivate the team behind the sticks more than most, Lockers just stood there time and time again, he never pointed at anyone, he never shouted or showed the players why we had leaked another try. He simple stood there leaving it too others.
I agree 100%. Is the "Dave" you disagree with someone else?
So what has changed?
Nothing!
I guess in training Lockers is still stood around quite but instead of the likes of Orr giving the instructions it is now the turn of Barrett.
Lockers can be a good club captain and I think he is happy with that role off the field. I also think he may be a very good captain off the field as far as being an honest player that portrays a clean image and life style. He can be good as a role model.
He doesn't need to be a captain to be a role model. In fact you could say a captain who does not captain is not a very good role model for any aspiring captains!
DaveO posted:
He doesn't need to be a captain to be a role model. In fact you could say a captain who does not captain is not a very good role model for any aspiring captains!
Dave
True to a point but i think the point made in reference to the role model thing is that a captain should be leading from the front and inspiring others predominently as a major attribute for the team.
Whether you shout and be courageous eg - Faz or quiet, it doesn't matter. The person who rallies his troops and is successful in no matter what way it is gone about is the most important thing and Lockers does not appear to have the demeanour or the aura about him.
Barret seems to have experience as captain, but when he came over here, he asked specifically that he would relish the opportunity not to have the burden of captaincy like he did at St. George.
DaveO posted:
He doesn't need to be a captain to be a role model. In fact you could say a captain who does not captain is not a very good role model for any aspiring captains!
True to a point but i think the point made in reference to the role model thing is that a captain should be leading from the front and inspiring others predominently as a major attribute for the team.
Well tjhat is the first qualification and I can't recall a good captain who didn't but that isn't the only qualification. It has been argued often enough that it is is good enough to lead by example by many on here and I don't think it is enough.
Whether you shout and be courageous eg - Faz or quiet, it doesn't matter. The person who rallies his troops and is successful in no matter what way it is gone about is the most important thing and Lockers does not appear to have the demeanour or the aura about him.
You can't rally the troops without opening your mouth and getting a bit animated at times. Great leaders in all walks of life are not the ones who simply do the hard graft and hope others will follow suit and that includes sport IMO and always has done.
Barret seems to have experience as captain, but when he came over here, he asked specifically that he would relish the opportunity not to have the burden of captaincy like he did at St. George.
Well according to WW that seems to have changed very rapidly.
This one is guess work but I would have thought that a player like Barrett cannot do anything other than stamp his personality onto a team and try and influence them towards his train of thought. What ever he says it is hard when you are passionate about something not to give it your all and take charge.
Trent Barrett suffered form wise individually when he was made captain of St George. Collectively the team suffered. Nobody should be made captain on their arrival as an overseas player IMO. It is unfair to that individual.
I honestly think you all blow out of proportion the vitriolic captain bellowing at his teammates. Faz was of that ilk. He was less successful than his predecessors. I do not blame him for that lack of success but according to what some believe it should have made a crucial difference. Think back and tell me how often did you see Westy shouting etc, how often did you see Bell shouting etc, how often did you see Ellery shouting etc?
More importantly. If you do see people shouting etc What impact does it have? Orr is a yapper. He's been unsuccessful and successful. Listen to so called team talks behind the sticks up to Academy Level and you will realise what utter crap is said. Every other word is very often let's F this, F that.
I still maintain captaincy is day in day out and what is happening away from match day is even more important. Lockers has had to deal with some incredibly difficult problems behind the scenes. Players have been totally unprofessional as regards their social life. One overcame his problems, two others were sent on their way. This club has had a negative environment since SL began. It needs far more than a soundbite captain. It needs a proper coach, a proper backroom staff and several players who are ultimate professionals. You want the first team to be full of leaders / role models.
I believe Lockers offers a stability we cannot find anywhere else within the squad. N.B Everybody who knows him properly like Mike Gregory raves about him. He has captained every team he has played for.
When we lose he is our whipping boy, when we win, no praise is offered.
cpwigan posted:
Trent Barrett suffered form wise individually when he was made captain of St George. Collectively the team suffered. Nobody should be made captain on their arrival as an overseas player IMO. It is unfair to that individual.
I honestly think you all blow out of proportion the vitriolic captain bellowing at his teammates. Faz was of that ilk. He was less successful than his predecessors. I do not blame him for that lack of success but according to what some believe it should have made a crucial difference. Think back and tell me how often did you see Westy shouting etc, how often did you see Bell shouting etc, how often did you see Ellery shouting etc?
More importantly. If you do see people shouting etc What impact does it have? Orr is a yapper. He's been unsuccessful and successful. Listen to so called team talks behind the sticks up to Academy Level and you will realise what utter crap is said. Every other word is very often let's F this, F that.
I still maintain captaincy is day in day out and what is happening away from match day is even more important. Lockers has had to deal with some incredibly difficult problems behind the scenes. Players have been totally unprofessional as regards their social life. One overcame his problems, two others were sent on their way. This club has had a negative environment since SL began. It needs far more than a soundbite captain. It needs a proper coach, a proper backroom staff and several players who are ultimate professionals. You want the first team to be full of leaders / role models.
I believe Lockers offers a stability we cannot find anywhere else within the squad. N.B Everybody who knows him properly like Mike Gregory raves about him. He has captained every team he has played for.
When we lose he is our whipping boy, when we win, no praise is offered.
One of the few posts that I totally disagree with.
cpwigan posted:
Trent Barrett suffered form wise individually when he was made captain of St George. Collectively the team suffered. Nobody should be made captain on their arrival as an overseas player IMO. It is unfair to that individual.
I honestly think you all blow out of proportion the vitriolic captain bellowing at his teammates. Faz was of that ilk. He was less successful than his predecessors. I do not blame him for that lack of success but according to what some believe it should have made a crucial difference. Think back and tell me how often did you see Westy shouting etc, how often did you see Bell shouting etc, how often did you see Ellery shouting etc?
More importantly. If you do see people shouting etc What impact does it have? Orr is a yapper. He's been unsuccessful and successful. Listen to so called team talks behind the sticks up to Academy Level and you will realise what utter crap is said. Every other word is very often let's F this, F that.
I still maintain captaincy is day in day out and what is happening away from match day is even more important. Lockers has had to deal with some incredibly difficult problems behind the scenes. Players have been totally unprofessional as regards their social life. One overcame his problems, two others were sent on their way. This club has had a negative environment since SL began. It needs far more than a soundbite captain. It needs a proper coach, a proper backroom staff and several players who are ultimate professionals. You want the first team to be full of leaders / role models.
I believe Lockers offers a stability we cannot find anywhere else within the squad. N.B Everybody who knows him properly like Mike Gregory raves about him. He has captained every team he has played for.
When we lose he is our whipping boy, when we win, no praise is offered.
Exellent post, I couldn't have put it better myself. I have been thinking the same as you regarding Sean's captaincy for quite some time, like you said it is much more important what he does and says on the training pitch and for the clubs image. He has had nothing but high praise from his team mates yet some of our supporters still belittle his abilities as a captain. Give the lad a break, will he get any praise off all of you if we win trophies? Which is what we should start doing in the near future with a settled coaching and back room structure and not such a high turnover of players.
