running angles/lines

[- psycho -]

why can't we do it?

few tiems this season we have run angles and lines at defences and it's paid off for us. leeds do it well, so do saints and the bulls, we do it the odd game and it works, trent/leuluia can do more with the ball then to.

we also don't seem to have second phases. to many times we give the ball width then just watch one of our players get crunched and we lose momentum.

[jammie]

i think last nignt proved how light weight we are up front at prop,we don't have a prop who can break a tackle and off load the ball when feka is off the field,hope we get a good prop to share the work load next season.we run angles in the warm up but never run them in the match have said before that it doesn't make any sense

[bigkarl]

Ever since I have played at a "higher" level so to speak. That what has bean drilled into me look for the lines and gaps then run your ass of getting into them you will 9 out of 10 times make a good 20 30 yards and with abit of look go down the field all the way. There is a couple of wigan players who are good at this Hock is brillaint at it Pat is quit good coming from the inside,Also players like fielden quite often run really good lines but end up getting poor ball of higham.

[cpwigan]

The players very often run brilliant lines BUT it is not enough at a professional level. Indeed, no matter how big and strong you are if it is 1 v 13 you will get tackled. Even Feka.

You need to have deception and deception only comes through having several players pushing towards the line at the same time. Our 'push' is very poor unless we are on the opposition line. Even then it could be a lot better. If players push you turn the game into 4 or 5 v 13 which is much harder than 1 v 13. You also get the opposition on the backfoot and progressively get on a roll through the set.

Equally, at a pro level you need an extra movement to a play. So for example. Trent goes out wide, he drops off to Lockers. That is not enough at pro level. You need Trent moving out wide, hitting Lockers on the drop off and wham somebody running into a hole off Lockers.

[nathan_rugby]

This is a matter that frustrates me. Wigan do not run angles. Plain and simple, the props sometimes get it almost at a stand still!

Hock runs at speed and trys to hit gaps, as does harrison hansen. I have also noticed goulding trying to do the same. This isnt good enough, Its not even good enough at the amatuer level i play at.

Can anybody remember that fantastic try against widnes when barret got the ball and dummied it outwide to give it lockers who was steaming onto the ball on the inside ? That is how to do it.

Maybe we would have more angle runners if people ran at speed and barret at more runners.

[Matthew]

nathan_rugby posted:
Can anybody remember that fantastic try against widnes when barret got the ball and dummied it outwide to give it lockers who was steaming onto the ball on the inside ? That is how to do it.

I remember a try like that against Leeds - it was the try of the match

[Bear]

if we got the wide shot on, to the center then you could have the winger comming on the inside with the center supporting him.

[Panchitta Marra]

cpwigan posted:
The players very often run brilliant lines BUT it is not enough at a professional level. Indeed, no matter how big and strong you are if it is 1 v 13 you will get tackled. Even Feka.

You need to have deception and deception only comes through having several players pushing towards the line at the same time. Our 'push' is very poor unless we are on the opposition line. Even then it could be a lot better. If players push you turn the game into 4 or 5 v 13 which is much harder than 1 v 13. You also get the opposition on the backfoot and progressively get on a roll through the set.

Equally, at a pro level you need an extra movement to a play. So for example. Trent goes out wide, he drops off to Lockers. That is not enough at pro level. You need Trent moving out wide, hitting Lockers on the drop off and wham somebody running into a hole off Lockers.

Do we not think that there is too much onus placed on Trent Barrett. We need more options for delivery of the ball to make it difficult for the oposition to read. At the moment we have, 'just Trent', which other teams realise, and endevour to snuff him out. Lu Lu should be made to create more options, taking some playing pressure off Trent, therefore creating alot more variety and confusion to the oposition. Against Stains we didnt look like breaking the game line with any form of passing and running, if it wasnt for the two kicks, we wouldnt have got across the whitewash.

[cpwigan]

I am always wary of these statements made by commentators re Trent doing everything blah blah. Oddly, Wally Lewis did likewise and so on. So I would rather have a dominant halfback such as Trent. However, I do agree ideally you want 2 dominant halfbacks such as Gregory / Edwards and Sterling / Lewis.

The biggest problem is that v Saints our forwards do not punch big enough holes and get a roll on to give any halfback the space and time to exploit gaps. Time and time again Trent was searching v a set defence and even really tough runners like Hock and Feka struggled to break through. The biggest failing Nobby has as regards coaching is the quality of his bread and butter yardage sets. You can see it for GB and for Wigan. Far too often, it is 1 v 13 and really easy to identify who the runner is going to be. Using plays where runners pushed towards the line in 3s and 4s would make yards easier to come by and set Trent and Lu Lu up better. If you look at Saints attacking structure. The blind side stand very flat, pushing up. Any team defending that blindside has concerns that Saints could easily go blind. So immediately 3 or 4 defenders are locked in to watching the blindside. Cunningham then crabs sideways with 3 or 4 players pushing up in support so you have 8 or 9 players to mark up. Much harder than the 1 v 13 we often give the opposition.

We could also use Trent as a decoy. As an example Trent screams and feint have the ball passed to him blind side. Indtead our hooker fires a flat pass to Fletcher or Feka on the open. Another, Lu Lu has the ball, Trent hits a hole really flat and screams for the ball. Lu Lu dummys and goes himself. The midfield chip kick is a goer v Saints too.

[Panchitta Marra]

cpwigan posted:
I am always wary of these statements made by commentators re Trent doing everything blah blah. Oddly, Wally Lewis did likewise and so on. So I would rather have a dominant halfback such as Trent. However, I do agree ideally you want 2 dominant halfbacks such as Gregory / Edwards and Sterling / Lewis.

The biggest problem is that v Saints our forwards do not punch big enough holes and get a roll on to give any halfback the space and time to exploit gaps. Time and time again Trent was searching v a set defence and even really tough runners like Hock and Feka struggled to break through. The biggest failing Nobby has as regards coaching is the quality of his bread and butter yardage sets. You can see it for GB and for Wigan. Far too often, it is 1 v 13 and really easy to identify who the runner is going to be. Using plays where runners pushed towards the line in 3s and 4s would make yards easier to come by and set Trent and Lu Lu up better. If you look at Saints attacking structure. The blind side stand very flat, pushing up. Any team defending that blindside has concerns that Saints could easily go blind. So immediately 3 or 4 defenders are locked in to watching the blindside. Cunningham then crabs sideways with 3 or 4 players pushing up in support so you have 8 or 9 players to mark up. Much harder than the 1 v 13 we often give the opposition.

We could also use Trent as a decoy. As an example Trent screams and feint have the ball passed to him blind side. Indtead our hooker fires a flat pass to Fletcher or Feka on the open. Another, Lu Lu has the ball, Trent hits a hole really flat and screams for the ball. Lu Lu dummys and goes himself. The midfield chip kick is a goer v Saints too.

Spot on CPWigan, we arent using enough options at the moment. It makes it easier for a team to weigh up the strategy if they know who the main play maker is, especially when very few others are making the plays. I dont agree that two dominant halfbacks are required in any one team, but we need more otions in play other than those coming from just Trent Barrett.