noble is a good coach

[sheepdip]

But wire and huddersfield, both have good teams on paper. Unfortunately i cant say the same for us, as we have so many youngsters, and a team that will only settle in a couple of years.

I think we have some great young players coming through and I can see plenty of potential and am hopefully looking forward to watching them mature and become great players. However, as others have pointed out I do not believe that the experienced players in the squad will guide them through. Lack of leadership on the field is a great problem. Our current batch of youngsters IMO are as good as anybodys.

[Big ref wit' glasses]

In some ways Brian Noble has been good for Wigan he is a steady character and a competant organizer which three years ago saved us from relegation. Unfortunatly we now need to move on to the next level and I don't think Nobby is the man to take us there.

His main problem is he is sooooo predictable.

Let's make a few predictions about this Friday

1. There will be no team changes apart from those forced by injury ie Tomkins in the second row with either Mossop or Goulding coming on to the bench, all other positions the same

2. The first kick off we deliver will land roughly on the try line about 10 metres to the left of the posts

3. Our attacking set of six for the first twenty minutes will be drive, drive, drive, drive, drive, kick. With perhaps a suicidal offload attempt which loses us the ball in our own half

4. After 15 to 20 minutes we will swap both props for another two and then reverse this change 15 minutes later.

5. After about 30 minutes Riddell will be swapped for either Flannagan or Goulding.

6. If we are forced to become expansive it will involve Sam Tomkins at second reciever

7. We wil never try a run around or employ dummy runners

I know all of these facts, you know all of these and you can bet Tony Smith knows all of these facts and after he has got over his post semi final hangover you can bet he's cooking up another plan to defeat our dull unimaginative tactics.

[ragman]

Some excellent posts here.

The truth of the matter is that we lost to the first decent team we came up against in the cup this year. Okay, we were lucky that we got as far as the semi final before that happened. No disrespect to Barrow, Wakefield and Salford, but if we are going to count them as a decent run in the cup then we might as well give up.

As another poster has said, no-one is suggesting that BN is a bad person or the worst coach in the world, but another truth is that we have lost a higher percentage of games in each successive season that he has been in charge - that's not progress.

Sometimes, as it did against Leeds, his gameplan will work, and we will win - but there isn't a plan B. There never was when he was at Bradford, but he had the pack and the huge backs at that time for it to come off more often that not.

Time to go Brian - the players and fans deserve better than this, and the players are capable of better than this.

[mike binder]

Yes we beat them drew with them and chased them very close in the later gaves, Proves an improvement to me. Sadly we are not allowed to progress because it will be trashed. WHY are we better on paper than Hud and Wire. I don't see where.
Oh the great sages on here say so. We will build to a winning team.
Jim

And how many attempts did it take? Are you happy to "chase them close"? Are you happy to go close; but never make a final? After the first year where Noble saved us from relegation; has the progress really been that great? Have we done that much better year on year? We've never been anywhere near winning top spot in the league and have only made it close to the grand final due to play off heroics inspired by the best player in the league.

Huddersfield is a team largely made up of players that Wigan decided were not good enough - and when they were at the club; they weren't. Mathers whilst not world class, was a far better player yesterday for wire than he was for Wigan earlier in the season.

I am not a rabid Noble hater and as I said; had we got to the final then I would have been OK with him having another year. But as it has been pretty much confirmed that we will have exactly the same squad next year - why do YOU think that we will do any better next season? What insight to the club do you have that makes you confident of that? Or is it just blind optimism?

Wigan were tactically exposed by an a superior coach using an average side. If Noble could not see that rat boy briers was going to kick the ball to glass jaw king then he must have been the only person in the ground to which it was a surprise. The same came be said for monaghan running at Feka.

At times Jim there isn't that much difference with the mentality of you and the Noble haters. Neither side is prepared to even consider that any other opinion than theirs might be correct.

I want Wigan to win something - and I don't think that they will with Noble in charge. So is it so wrong for me to want a new coach? I don't want him hung or publicly flogged; I don't think he is a bad person or a terrible coach - I just think that he has had his chance and it is now time for him to move on and for someone else to have a go.

Who knows; they may not be any better - but if not now then when? Are we going to persevere with Noble until he DOES win something?

great sensible post Mat

[mike binder]

some really good post on here dont think any 1 can argue with anything said by any body ,i took think nobby is at the end of his time but i do feel we are all most there as a team ,so maybe only maybe another 12 months would be a option remember we for the fist time in years dont have 4 or 5 first team players leaving at the end of the season so maybe a steady ship could be a better option

[cpwigan]

How long has Tony Smith had at Wire, How long has Nathan Brown had at Huddersfield?

Brian Noble was part of the reason we lost yesterday. He is a coward when it comes to selecting teams. He is a coach that throughout his career has always opted for a safety first policy of opting for experience over youth. He did it again yesterday. It was not based on merit etc and it backfired badly.

If fans had listened carefully to the fans forum they would have realised that for all the PR of how Ian and Brian are in love with each other when it came to discussing youth development IL actually stated that he and Noble disagree on the policy and given what IL said it is apparent that Noble wants to sign even more experienced players.

The one advantage Wigan have over other clubs is the quality of its young players. They are better than all other clubs. Only Saints have anything comparable.

The one disadvantage we have over other clubs is the millstone of our most highly paid players not earning their money. Fielden and Feka not IL signing kill this club.

IL signed Martin Gleeson good player but be aware that he is now on a fantastic contract. He was paid 150K at Wire. Wigan signed him at 180K but because of the salary cap that is not distributed evenly. In 2009 he is far far less but what he is not being paid now he will be paid in 2010. He will be the highest paid player at Wigan RLFC in 2010 and possibly SL.

Either Noble or Il is right or wrong. One says one thing at the fans forum. The other does exactly the opposite 3 days later. Maybe George Carmont was wrong about the impact of young players too.

I am led to believe Brian Noble has been offered a 12 month contract but turned it down. I have no doubt Brian Noble will get a job in SL almost immediately when he leaves and let's hope he takes Mike Forshaw with him. Noble has an ego. Nothing wrong with that but he likes to surround himself with people who pamper his ego. That is his great weakness. The shortlist to replace Brian Smith at Newcastle contained coaches who are all better than Noble.

Wigan cannot change the players they have in 2010. They can change how they are coached. How they are conditioned.

The yes or no debate on Brian Noble's future has been to the detriment of Wigan RLFC. It has been badly handled. I may not rate him as a coach but as a person I think Noble deserved better from Wigan RLFC.

[GeoffN]

You can add Justin Morgan to the list of coaches that have brought their teams up further and faster than us.

Don't forget, too, that this is almost entirely a Noble-built team. Every player bar one has been signed or retained while he was in charge.

[bikerharry]

CP, you keep banging on about Fielden and Feka, but I don't think the problems our club has, is deep rooted in the playing staff. The problem we have is, we have a coach who doesn't bring out the potential in those players. There is no team within the league who is going to have international star players from 1 to 17, with another 17 in the waiting. The salary cap just doesn't allow for it. With the odd exceptions, we have, I believe, the potential within the players to achieve alot more than we have done. Let's be realistic, Wire didn't have a team of internationals yesterday, but they had a team of well coached players who wanted it more. You heard Carney say that they had been watching countless videos of previous Wigan games, and knew where our strengths a weaknesses lay, and they exploited them to the full, the first half especially. In essence, Smith coached them to play and beat Wigan yesterday, but had they been playing Saints for example, he would have coached Wire to exploit their weaknesses instead. To my mind Noble starts the season with a game plan, but does very little in the way of adapting it week to week to suit who we are playing.
I'm not an avid "Noble hater", I think he's done a job at Wigan, and brought about an element of stabillity, but as I have posted before, I do believe he has taken us as far as HE can. Look at Ainscough, in the right hands this lad could be world class, but instead of coaching him and bringing him on, Noble leaves him languishing in the reserve grade under the pretense of "duty of care". Yes we could get rid of Fielden and Feka, and free up the large quantities of money we spend on them, but would that solve our problems? I don't think so. We could bring in "better" players, but what's the point if they aren't going to be coached. Given our current squad, Fielden and Feka included, the vast majority of current superleague coaches would have won that game yesterday. We lost.
As i have said earlier, the potential is there, (yes including the two F's), but lets find a coach who can tap into it, and when this starts to bring the success, maybe we'll have the draw to attract the big name signings, without having to pay them the earth.

[gillysmyhero]

He might be a good coach but i dont at what sport

[cpwigan]

Harry you will not get any argument from me that the potential is there. SL in 2009 is weaker than ever at the top with both Saints and Leeds in transition. The overall standard is probably better with wins having to be earned BUT no club/no team is under achieving more than Wigan because as you rightly say we have the players and if you compared Wigan v Warrington many of the Wire players were poorer or no better than their Wigan counterpart.

Something has to change. If it is the coach and backroom staff (especially Forshaw) then so be it but for whatever reason the big name players are letting Wigan RLFC down. you cannot pay players so much and get so little from them.