FEEDER CLUB FOR NRL

[Kittwazzer]

I reckon the overall situation is going to get worse before it gets any better. Just been having a conversation with one of our young players and I asked him in general terms if he fancied playing NRL. No hesitation, he said he'd jump at the chance!

Seems there has been a major shift in mindsets. At one time, every youngster putting on a shirt for the first time dreamt of playing for his town team. That was the height of his ambition.

What was once a pinnacle is now apparently a stepping stone. Kids no longer want to be the next Tomkins, Edwards or Farrell. They want to be Inglis, Slater and Cronk.

[DaveO]

I reckon the overall situation is going to get worse before it gets any better. Just been having a conversation with one of our young players and I asked him in general terms if he fancied playing NRL. No hesitation, he said he'd jump at the chance!

Seems there has been a major shift in mindsets. At one time, every youngster putting on a shirt for the first time dreamt of playing for his town team. That was the height of his ambition.

What was once a pinnacle is now apparently a stepping stone. Kids no longer want to be the next Tomkins, Edwards or Farrell. They want to be Inglis, Slater and Cronk.

And with Wigan why wouldn't they think they could? The tack taken by IL of letting players leave so easily will not protect the club IMO and its as if this is now the defined career path.

[keptinthedarkfans]

I reckon the overall situation is going to get worse before it gets any better. Just been having a conversation with one of our young players and I asked him in general terms if he fancied playing NRL. No hesitation, he said he'd jump at the chance!

Seems there has been a major shift in mindsets. At one time, every youngster putting on a shirt for the first time dreamt of playing for his town team. That was the height of his ambition.

What was once a pinnacle is now apparently a stepping stone. Kids no longer want to be the next Tomkins, Edwards or Farrell. They want to be Inglis, Slater and Cronk.

And with Wigan why wouldn't they think they could? The tack taken by IL of letting players leave so easily will not protect the club IMO and its as if this is now the defined career path.

This was the point I was trying to make about Sam not having a choice.And Wigan being a feeder club It seems to me that IL and SW are actively encouraging the youngsters that a spell in the NRL will enhance there skills and make them better players for there return to Wigan. This is not only a dangerous game they are playing but imo a stupid one.Kitt Imo all I see on a regular basis the youngsters at Wigan have one thing in there hearts that is to play for there home town club . I may come across as bitter towards IL and SW. but this is not true as they have done a lot of good in the club. But the route they are going down now is for money purposes only and not to win Wigan trophy's

[morley pie eater]

OK I haven't read every word on this topic but, apart from IL and SW being useless and should say they want Sam to stay, where are the constructive suggestions as to exactly what they should be doing to achieve this??

Has anyone considered that they know Sam is going, so are planning for life without him? Or that their statements to the press are intended to put pressure on the RFL to allow exceptions to the salary cap? Or even that they know what they're doing? Excuse me while I clean my cherry and white glasses . . .

[DaveO]

OK I haven't read every word on this topic but, apart from IL and SW being useless and should say they want Sam to stay, where are the constructive suggestions as to exactly what they should be doing to achieve this??

What is wrong with holding him to at least the first three years of his contract which was supposed to ensure he didn't talk to RU or other RL clubs?

It's already been mentioned in this thread at least that would give more time for the junior players to gain some experience.

That seems pretty constructive to me

Has anyone considered that they know Sam is going, so are planning for life without him? Or that their statements to the press are intended to put pressure on the RFL to allow exceptions to the salary cap? Or even that they know what they're doing? Excuse me while I clean my cherry and white glasses . . .

I don't think letting a player like Sam leave earlier than expected qualifies as "they know what they are doing". I don't think that shows much planning either (see the comment above re young players readiness).

With the other stuff why be so circumspect about it and why expect the RFL to read between the lines and second guess Wigan would really like them to make Sam a special case?

This really doesn't make sense and neither does most of the reading between the lines a lot of fans do to try and justify it when the club screws up.

[morley pie eater]

Hi Dave, I was working on the basis that a contract can always be ended - one reason clubs (in RL and other sports) tie star players to long contracts is to ensure they get a decent payout when the player leaves before the contract is up.
Assuming Wigan could hold Sam to his 3 years - would it be sensible to force a player to stay if he wants to leave?

As to IL trying to influence the RFL, that was simply my way of saying that we can all speculate on other people's motives, but, in the end, it's just speculation.

I don't view IL through cherry and white glasses, but (1) he seems to me to have done a good job so far, and (2) I find it hard to believe that he wants Sam to go. It seems much more likely that, knowing the full facts (which we don't), he has to "make the best of a bad job" and has attempted to make his public statements positive, as in SW responding to 8 players out injured by focusing on the young players coming in.

The facts are that Super League is unable to compete financially with, or offer players a comparable profile to union and the NRL. The gap is much wider than at any time in the past. We all have to come to terms with this. Until we can afford a £5 million salary cap, we are going to lose top players. Finding a way to deal with this, like Lee Mossop's proposed return after a few years, is probably the most realistic response?

[Kittwazzer]

Morley, don't feed Dave with the "Assuming Wigan could hold Sam to his 3 years - would it be sensible to force a player to stay if he wants to leave?" line.

Its a red rag to a bull!

[DaveO]

Hi Dave, I was working on the basis that a contract can always be ended - one reason clubs (in RL and other sports) tie star players to long contracts is to ensure they get a decent payout when the player leaves before the contract is up.
Assuming Wigan could hold Sam to his 3 years - would it be sensible to force a player to stay if he wants to leave?

Why ask that question?

There is no evidence he doesn't want to stay. His willingness to sign the kind of contract he did said he was willing to stay for at least three years.

He couldn't instigate a move himself and was seemingly happy not to be doing so for three years.

You are asking the wrong question IMO.

The question that should be asked is why given this deal is he apparently going to be leaving after two year? And I don't think an adequate or realistic answer is he himself wants out.

My view is he was happy to stick to the contract terms but when IL was approached he made it an option for Sam to leave. If so God knows why when he could have waited another 12 months and there would have still been a queue for Sam.

As to IL trying to influence the RFL, that was simply my way of saying that we can all speculate on other people's motives, but, in the end, it's just speculation.

Well no disrespect but I don't think the suggestion you made was very realistic.

I don't view IL through cherry and white glasses, but (1) he seems to me to have done a good job so far, and (2) I find it hard to believe that he wants Sam to go. It seems much more likely that, knowing the full facts (which we don't), he has to "make the best of a bad job" and has attempted to make his public statements positive, as in SW responding to 8 players out injured by focusing on the young players coming in.

I don't see the connection between the day to day commentary on the team and Sam possibly leaving.

If Sam does go early you just watch the spin come from the club.

The facts are that Super League is unable to compete financially with, or offer players a comparable profile to union and the NRL. The gap is much wider than at any time in the past. We all have to come to terms with this. Until we can afford a £5 million salary cap, we are going to lose top players. Finding a way to deal with this, like Lee Mossop's proposed return after a few years, is probably the most realistic response?

I know you said you hadn't read the whole topic but of you had you would have realised the general points you make above have been done to death.

If you read my posts on places like RLFANS and on here about what needs to happen money-wise and so on you would know none of what you say above is news to me. In fact it's stating the obvious we can't complete.

However when the club seemingly recognises this by coming up with a contract specifically designed to mitigate these problems at least in the short term whereby they make Sam the highest paid player in the UK game, get the RFL on board to do so and then rip all that up we are not talking the general case.

[morley pie eater]

Hi Dave, I was working on the basis that a contract can always be ended - one reason clubs (in RL and other sports) tie star players to long contracts is to ensure they get a decent payout when the player leaves before the contract is up.
Assuming Wigan could hold Sam to his 3 years - would it be sensible to force a player to stay if he wants to leave?

Why ask that question?

There is no evidence he doesn't want to stay. His willingness to sign the kind of contract he did said he was willing to stay for at least three years.

He couldn't instigate a move himself and was seemingly happy not to be doing so for three years.

You are asking the wrong question IMO.

The question that should be asked is why given this deal is he apparently going to be leaving after two year? And I don't think an adequate or realistic answer is he himself wants out.

Sorry, Dave, but "there is no evidence he doesn't want to stay"?? If this is true, then he is being forced out against his will? Really??

[southernpie]

Hi Dave, I was working on the basis that a contract can always be ended - one reason clubs (in RL and other sports) tie star players to long contracts is to ensure they get a decent payout when the player leaves before the contract is up.
Assuming Wigan could hold Sam to his 3 years - would it be sensible to force a player to stay if he wants to leave?

Why ask that question?

There is no evidence he doesn't want to stay. His willingness to sign the kind of contract he did said he was willing to stay for at least three years.

He couldn't instigate a move himself and was seemingly happy not to be doing so for three years.

You are asking the wrong question IMO.

The question that should be asked is why given this deal is he apparently going to be leaving after two year? And I don't think an adequate or realistic answer is he himself wants out.

Sorry, Dave, but "there is no evidence he doesn't want to stay"?? If this is true, then he is being forced out against his will? Really??

Sorry Morley I am with DaveO here. Sam's contract was for 5 years with a clause that he couldn't even speak to other clubs for 3 years. All other clubs knew they couldn't speak to him for this period. Therefore if an offer has come in, it must have been to the club, not via Sam, also at the press conference to announce the signing of Andy Powell, it was IL who said Sam may not be here next year, leading many people on here to believe IL is hawking Sam around the NRL. Sam may not mind if he gets to leave early, but because of the 3 year clause it has to be at the club's instigation.