Castleford

[up the junction]

How can my post be ill informed when I've not been been Informed of anything.As I said ,IN MY OPINION that's what it was ,my opinion to the question who in the Cas . Side is better than in our side ,and in my opinion which isn't stupid either,Webster Battered Sarge in the Centres ,which IN MY OPINION he did ,Sarge is never and will never be a centre ,there was quite a lot more to Websters game than that one pass,he played Sarge off the park.So please don't imply that I'm stupid.

In the first instance I said the comment was stupid. That implies nothing other than the comment was stupid, and it was stupid because it was factually incorrect. If you want to take it some other way, that is your problem and not mine.


Secondly, what you said was
Jake Webster battered Sarginson off the pitch.

Then you said

in your opinion Sarginson cannot play centre.

The second one is an opinion which I neither disagreed or agreed with in response.

The first one isn't an opinion, it is a statement of fact, and it is absolutely untrue on any level. If it is your opinion that he was battered of the pitch, please point me to where the battering started.

An informed comment or opinion is based on knowledge of the facts; you watch the game and the team as I do and your opinion on Sarginson as a centre is based on the facts as you see them and it is yours to have.
However, we both watched the game yesterday and we can take the facts from that game to make an argument as to where it went wrong. The facts are that at no point did Webster batter Sarge off the park, so whether you like it or not, you have not considered any of the facts, which means your comment was ill informed.

Definition of informed - having or prepared with information or knowledge.

You are absolutely correct when you say you have not been informed about anything, because you simply ignored the evidence of 80 minutes of Rugby League


I watched the game at the time, and twice on iplayer. This, 'there is more to Websters game' is total crap. There was nothing that Webster did do, or could do, to affect the game on that edge because they were completely contained on that edge save for the try, which was down to Budgie. The only other break they made on that edge was because Sarge as last line of defence had just pulled Dixon down and the line was in disarray due to the quick ptb, and the fact Sarge was on his arse.

Point me to the instances in the game were Webster got the upper hand? You cannot do it, because it didn't happen, and that is factual for anyone who wants to view the game again with a view to analysing it.


And to cpw, no I'm not a Sarge disciple, it just really kills my pig when people make a scapegoat out of someone who did nothing wrong.

And neither did he do anything as a centre right.

[cpwigan]

I am not sure anybody from the Wigan team from coach to every player was blameless. I believe Sarge has potential but sadly he is still learning to play the game and where his best position actually is. I honestly do not know myself.

I personally see a very keen player with some evasive skill albeit it is a bit lateral and a tad one trick pony ploy. He made an excellent break v Cas. Defensively I did not see any glaring errors but I also did not see anything exceptional. The worst trait for me is that with Gelling / Sarge as your centres you have two runners who are essentially in the first instance selfish before they even consider using their winger. I cannot say what any of our centres / wingers are like in terms of on field communication. Ordinarily I would select Goulding before Sarge / Gel but he has been average at best this season, possibly injured / less than 100% fit?

I do think if we are honest and I know we try to think positively but Sarge / Gel and even Goulding perhaps are not centres of the highest quality. I have more faith in Goulding personally. Nevertheless, Sarge and Gel are not in the same class as proper Wigan centres IMO!

Bring back Gleeson

Bring back Gene Miles or Dean Bell or George Carmont etc etc etc.

[shaunedwardsfanclub]

I am not sure anybody from the Wigan team from coach to every player was blameless. I believe Sarge has potential but sadly he is still learning to play the game and where his best position actually is. I honestly do not know myself.

I personally see a very keen player with some evasive skill albeit it is a bit lateral and a tad one trick pony ploy. He made an excellent break v Cas. Defensively I did not see any glaring errors but I also did not see anything exceptional. The worst trait for me is that with Gelling / Sarge as your centres you have two runners who are essentially in the first instance selfish before they even consider using their winger. I cannot say what any of our centres / wingers are like in terms of on field communication. Ordinarily I would select Goulding before Sarge / Gel but he has been average at best this season, possibly injured / less than 100% fit?

I do think if we are honest and I know we try to think positively but Sarge / Gel and even Goulding perhaps are not centres of the highest quality. I have more faith in Goulding personally. Nevertheless, Sarge and Gel are not in the same class as proper Wigan centres IMO!

Bring back Gleeson

Bring back Gene Miles or Dean Bell or George Carmont etc etc etc.

Any decent centre would do. Whilst I would never knock Sarginson or gelling for their effort, they simply don't have the skill set to be centres. Let's be honest Shenton looks on another planet to those two!

[cpwigan]

It was to see Shenton looking so good v our centres.

[Panchitta Marra]

Sarginson seldom makes runs to assist his winger, he is good at stepping and trying to go it on his own but that's about it.
I have seen nothing in Sarginson's game to convince me that he is a centre.
For what its worth I thought we missed greens creativity yesterday more than anything and the nearest player we have as to that creativity is Ryan Hampshire. It didn't seem to work with George Williams paired with matty smith. Georges style is more of a darting half with less creativity which we lacked massively.
Did waney get that call wrong?

[DaveO]

The Webster set up....it wasn't Sarges fault it was Budgies fault, and was at fault for quite a few things yesterday but goes under the radar.

I thought Sarge was fairly solid
Singling out our centres is very unfair. Gelling had a fine game, as did an unfit Farrell. It was the fluency in attack which screwed us over. Manfredi also had a good game but hasn't been given any credit.

Flower?? Why? Clearly not match fit, 100% why play him? I would have had Burke playing prop everyday of the week. Also why is Charnley being forced to go on dual reg, and Flower not?

There is some issue here or am I reading too much into it?

No issues IMO. Just bad decision making by Wane.

[Wiganer Ted]

I was always worried about Sargey playing at 4 against cas.
It failed at their place where they ripped our left defence apart. To repeat that selection wasn't the best.

With 7 missing plus Micky Mac, Flower, Faz & Lockers clearly not fit it was a wonder we only lost with 12 and ten of those scored in the last 10 mins.

Pity we are out of the Cup but if we can get our best 17 out there at some point this season then we could have a very good second half to the league season.

[Kaii]

I was always worried about Sargey playing at 4 against cas.
It failed at their place where they ripped our left defence apart. To repeat that selection wasn't the best.

With 7 missing plus Micky Mac, Flower, Faz & Lockers clearly not fit it was a wonder we only lost with 12 and ten of those scored in the last 10 mins.

Pity we are out of the Cup but if we can get our best 17 out there at some point this season then we could have a very good second half to the league season.

Now we are out of the cup and play offs almost guaranteed expect to see a lot more rotation while we wait for the play offs

[Owd Codger]

Nobody from Cas had a bad game, in fact they did the basics very well BUT if doing the basic well = beating Wigan in such a big game then surely we have a problem. I was brought up watching Wigan teams that when it mattered (bar Cas in the RT final when they threw the game) Wigan TURNED UP and WON TIME ANd TIME AGAIN.

IMO, Wigan were outcoached and outplayed by a TEAM putting great effort in but not offering ANYTHING amazing. The fact Cas simply had to defend reasonably well is a sad indicement on Wigan RL 2014 / SL 2014!

They also turned up with more or less a fully fit side with no crop of injuries, especially to key positions like Stand Off, Hooker, Props and loose forward. Everyone is going on about Gelling and Sarginson but there has not been one mention of O'Loughlin having one of the worse games I have ever seen him play, due to like, Mcllorum and Flower etc not being fully match fit.

The cup tie could not have come at a worse time for us and I will stick my neck out and say that if Wigan had turned out a fully fit and full strength team, the result would have been different.

So lets move on and stop blaming all and sundry on who was to blame.

[weststand-rich]

Bring back Denis Moran!

We just looked flat and the inexperience of some of the younger lads was exposed. Enthusiasm and verve will cover up a multitude of sins in an injury hit side, but sooner or later it runs out of steam. A combination of youth, players returning from injury and mix and match was never going to win a high pressure game.

Still our desparation injury hit side is still better than most.