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DaveO wrote:

i'm spartacus wrote:

DaveO wrote:What a sad day for Britain and what tragedy for her young children, husband and family.

I fear what transpired today is a result of months and months of misguided rhetoric aimed at immigrants and refugees and also the the stoking of nationalism.

We have opened Pandora's box and as a result we have given our species's innate prejudices (tribalism, jingoism, racism, etc) a platform. Black day for British society and British politics.

A sad day indeed when anyone loses their life needlessly. However, making sweeping statements about what you believe is a political view formed through rhetoric, is more likely to be a result of the unstable thought processes of individual plagued by years of mental health issues.

There have been at least three people in the last month who have been jailed for killing random people because of their instability. Mental health service policies and practice is in the main, very poor, and has been for a long time.

The mental health angle is a cop out. Are ISIS terrorists mentally deranged?

You and I probably think anyone who kills in cold blood is mentally ill but you can't get away from the fact that people who do often justify their actions and are often sparked off by wider events.

The anti-immigration rhetoric and the way immigrants and refugees have been scapegoated is a disgrace (look at the UKIP posters which are fit for nothing other than Nazi Germany) and when actual politicians as opposed to extreme nut cases like "Britain First" are making such scapegoating mainstream it legitimises prejudice.

Much will be made of the mental illness and wrong time wrong place angle but the increasingly nationalistic tone of the Leave campaign has given people with extreme views a convenient peg on which to hang their prejudices and the unstable an excuse.

You may be interested to know Jo Cox was under consideration for police protection after months of abuse on social media and at least one other MP has had to get the police in after threats of violence and threats have been made to a councillor because they had a "Remain" sticker on their car.

I normally find Polly Toynbee to much trouble to read as she tends to use a 1000 words when 10 would suffice but I think she nails what I am trying to say here:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... ead-jo-cox

yokozuna wrote:To put out bluntly, that's bollocks.

He has lots of links to far right groups. He targeted that brilliant woman because of her ideology and work with immigrants, etc.

It's exactly the definition of a terrorist attack, except he's not brown, so the focus is on him being a "timid loner". He's a violent murderer, driven by hatred and he didn't pick her out by accident.

To pretend it's not a terrorist attack is to insult Jo Cox and her legacy.

yokozuna wrote:To put out bluntly, that's bollocks.

He has lots of links to far right groups. He targeted that brilliant woman because of her ideology and work with immigrants, etc.

It's exactly the definition of a terrorist attack, except he's not brown, so the focus is on him being a "timid loner". He's a violent murderer, driven by hatred and he didn't pick her out by accident.

To pretend it's not a terrorist attack is to insult Jo Cox and her legacy.

yokozuna wrote:To put out bluntly, that's bollocks.

He has lots of links to far right groups. He targeted that brilliant woman because of her ideology and work with immigrants, etc.

It's exactly the definition of a terrorist attack, except he's not brown, so the focus is on him being a "timid loner". He's a violent murderer, driven by hatred and he didn't pick her out by accident.

To pretend it's not a terrorist attack is to insult Jo Cox and her legacy.

SJ wrote:

DaveO wrote:

i'm spartacus wrote: A sad day indeed when anyone loses their life needlessly. However, making sweeping statements about what you believe is a political view formed through rhetoric, is more likely to be a result of the unstable thought processes of individual plagued by years of mental health issues.

There have been at least three people in the last month who have been jailed for killing random people because of their instability. Mental health service policies and practice is in the main, very poor, and has been for a long time.

The mental health angle is a cop out. Are ISIS terrorists mentally deranged?

You and I probably think anyone who kills in cold blood is mentally ill but you can't get away from the fact that people who do often justify their actions and are often sparked off by wider events.

The anti-immigration rhetoric and the way immigrants and refugees have been scapegoated is a disgrace (look at the UKIP posters which are fit for nothing other than Nazi Germany) and when actual politicians as opposed to extreme nut cases like "Britain First" are making such scapegoating mainstream it legitimises prejudice.

Much will be made of the mental illness and wrong time wrong place angle but the increasingly nationalistic tone of the Leave campaign has given people with extreme views a convenient peg on which to hang their prejudices and the unstable an excuse.

You may be interested to know Jo Cox was under consideration for police protection after months of abuse on social media and at least one other MP has had to get the police in after threats of violence and threats have been made to a councillor because they had a "Remain" sticker on their car.

I normally find Polly Toynbee to much trouble to read as she tends to use a 1000 words when 10 would suffice but I think she nails what I am trying to say here:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... ead-jo-cox

Shame on you Dave for your attempt to politisis this young woman's callous murder to point the finger at the leave campaign
Are you now an expert on this matter. All we are told is the suspect has a history of mental illness It's quite insensitive to make assumptions at this time.

DaveO wrote:

josie andrews wrote:What is this world, not just this country, coming to?

There is so much violence everywhere. Fuelled, IMO, not just with race, religion & politics, but everything portrays violence, sex & swearing & no respect or regard for our fellow man.

Films, TV, video games are overrun with it, so much so that people are becoming to think it is the norm.

It's more than that Josie. We are going backwards as a civilised society.

In my view this tragic episode is a culmination of the stoking up of anti-immigrant feeling and racism that politicians have done deliberately to garner votes. They exaggerate the problem deliberately. Even lie about it and people fall for it.

It's is along the same lines of of setting people off against "benefit cheats". Now as a result everyone benefits is a scrounger.

It is nasty politics that sets one part of society against the other but crucially does so by playing on people's prejudices.

It is also very cynical. They get their votes and don't care what damage they do along the way. Well now look!

DaveO wrote:

SJ wrote:

DaveO wrote: The mental health angle is a cop out. Are ISIS terrorists mentally deranged?

You and I probably think anyone who kills in cold blood is mentally ill but you can't get away from the fact that people who do often justify their actions and are often sparked off by wider events.

The anti-immigration rhetoric and the way immigrants and refugees have been scapegoated is a disgrace (look at the UKIP posters which are fit for nothing other than Nazi Germany) and when actual politicians as opposed to extreme nut cases like "Britain First" are making such scapegoating mainstream it legitimises prejudice.

Much will be made of the mental illness and wrong time wrong place angle but the increasingly nationalistic tone of the Leave campaign has given people with extreme views a convenient peg on which to hang their prejudices and the unstable an excuse.

You may be interested to know Jo Cox was under consideration for police protection after months of abuse on social media and at least one other MP has had to get the police in after threats of violence and threats have been made to a councillor because they had a "Remain" sticker on their car.

I normally find Polly Toynbee to much trouble to read as she tends to use a 1000 words when 10 would suffice but I think she nails what I am trying to say here:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... ead-jo-cox

Shame on you Dave for your attempt to politisis this young woman's callous murder to point the finger at the leave campaign
Are you now an expert on this matter. All we are told is the suspect has a history of mental illness It's quite insensitive to make assumptions at this time.

Give over. You just don't want to hear truth.

Given what he yelled out in his appearance in the magistrates court “death to traitors, freedom for Britain” and claimed to police when arrested he was a political activist he is no different to any other radicalised terrorist.

Yes they all have screw loose because they all have a warped view of the world having been fed a constant pack of lies and become radicalised. How was he radicalised?

Have a look at this:

https://flic.kr/p/J8o9mu

Those are headlines in one paper from mostly this year. They aren't reporting facts they are trying to shape public opinion with a constant never ending diatribe. They are not alone.

The fact someone has taken extreme action is in my view a consequence of a deliberate narrative of never ending slagging off of migrants and blowing the migration issue out of all proportion from the media (mostly Murdoch owned media) and certain political parties and politicians. Those doing it no doubt never thought it would radicalise a white British male but they most certainly see painting the picture they do as a means to an end. Now looks what has happened.

He knew exactly who he was going after and it wasn't a random attack.