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Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Sun May 30, 2021 10:25 am
by Southern Softy
Thought I'd wait and not post straightaway but it didn't really make any difference. Everyone saw something coming via our last few performances but no one saw anything like that. It looked like an early round of the Cup where a pro side finds itself up against a bunch of amateurs. That's how bad it seemed to me, except that the amateurs would try harder.
A couple of things and they're not meant to single out players because everyone was as bad as anyone else.
In the first half, compare the PTB. For Wigan, Powell takes the heel, moves right, takes a couple of steps and releases a slow, relatively short pass. Result - the receiver has the entire Cats defence in his face. For Cats, Micky Mac takes the heel and immediately fires out a medium-long pass. Result - the Cats player has time to assess lots of options because no one is close to him.
Later, Smithies (and it could have been any forward) makes a brilliant try-saving tackle in midfield but can't resist a bit of following nonsense. Result - a set restart and a try follows.
I can't remember a game where we never really looked like scoring after Bibby had bombed the early chance by not passing to Manfredi. Even if we had scored, I doubt it would have made a difference, judging by Dom's later break when he looked to pass and no Wigan player was within twenty metres of him.
I've really no idea how you come back from a performance like that. Our best defender was probably Tommy but he was our least effective kicker and attacker. Shorrocks saved a try and never gave up and Faz made yards in the tackle when no one else seemed to. If those were the highpoints, then heaven help us.
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Sun May 30, 2021 10:40 am
by Barney841
Southern Softy wrote: ↑Sun May 30, 2021 10:25 am
Thought I'd wait and not post straightaway but it didn't really make any difference. Everyone saw something coming via our last few performances but no one saw anything like that. It looked like an early round of the Cup where a pro side finds itself up against a bunch of amateurs. That's how bad it seemed to me, except that the amateurs would try harder.
A couple of things and they're not meant to single out players because everyone was as bad as anyone else.
In the first half, compare the PTB. For Wigan, Powell takes the heel, moves right, takes a couple of steps and releases a slow, relatively short pass. Result - the receiver has the entire Cats defence in his face. For Cats, Micky Mac takes the heel and immediately fires out a medium-long pass. Result - the Cats player has time to assess lots of options because no one is close to him.
Later, Smithies (and it could have been any forward) makes a brilliant try-saving tackle in midfield but can't resist a bit of following nonsense. Result - a set restart and a try follows.
I can't remember a game where we never really looked like scoring after Bibby had bombed the early chance by not passing to Manfredi. Even if we had scored, I doubt it would have made a difference, judging by Dom's later break when he looked to pass and no Wigan player was within twenty metres of him.
I've really no idea how you come back from a performance like that. Our best defender was probably Tommy but he was our least effective kicker and attacker. Shorrocks saved a try and never gave up and Faz made yards in the tackle when no one else seemed to. If those were the highpoints, then heaven help us.
I mentioned a cricket score when we played saints, I didn’t think it would come against Catalan.
Catalan showed they can beat anyone on there day. Good, big strong pack with good backs. Sam T showed Wigan up, they’d be even better if they had Folau there.
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Sun May 30, 2021 12:43 pm
by Caboosegg
The comment about Manfredis break is one of my biggest concerns with Wigan of late and something you wouldn't expect to be an issue with a "more attacking" brand of rugby. Wigan do not seem to have any support play for breaks. Even if we fix the go forward issue we need better support play to take advantage of breaks.
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Sun May 30, 2021 1:25 pm
by southportcdm
I agree with the last post in that our support play has been poor for some time. Perhaps the players put too much emphasis in terms of their energy output on defence but top teams seem to be able to cope with both. Surely support play is part of a coaching philosophy? If you watch for e.g. a Melbourne or Penrith (I realise that they are exceptional) player make a break they always have a couple of options and both of these teams can defend too. When Harry Smith made that break against Salford only Faz got anywhere near him and he came from the other side of the pitch. A similar problem is seen when our halfbacks are running across the line looking to make a pass and they have zero or just single option. These problems must be connected with coaching and the difficulty for me is that our coach was a very good (world class?) halfback who must surely understand what's required in this area. Either Lammy played purely on instinct or else he can't get across what he knows to our players. For a club that's so proud of how we produce so many talented youngsters it's painful to see how their development stalls and the team doesn't progress.
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Mon May 31, 2021 7:56 am
by ian.birchall
Is there a fault on Wigan TV??
Just opened the 15 minutes highlights of the Cats game and they have not included any of the Wigan tries.
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:38 am
by culinator
I agree with almost all thats been said on here.
I would add though when talking about the forwards, not only do they not seem big enough but for me they always seem to catch the ball stood still, how can we ever break the line if we dont run at it?
Also when French came, he added a bit of excitement, someone who could actually cause teams problems and had explosive speed, the kind of player you get jitters when they get the ball, do i get that kind of feeling when any one else on our team gets the ball, im afraid not.
That for me makes the games quite boring, been thinking this way since Wayne took over, yes its good to win but its better to win in style, similar can be said of losing.
These are just my own opinions, different people like to see different things.
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:46 am
by fozzieskem
ian.birchall wrote: ↑Mon May 31, 2021 7:56 am
Is there a fault on Wigan TV??
Just opened the 15 minutes highlights of the Cats game and they have not included any of the Wigan tries.
You wag you
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2021 10:18 am
by pearsy
Looks like Wigans women have have an attacking plan and a decent kicker maybe they should be in the first team?
Re: 21-man squad v Catalans
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2021 10:51 am
by mickali1
culinator wrote: ↑Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:38 am
I agree with almost all thats been said on here.
I would add though when talking about the forwards, not only do they not seem big enough but for me they always seem to catch the ball stood still, how can we ever break the line if we dont run at it?
Also when French came, he added a bit of excitement, someone who could actually cause teams problems and had explosive speed, the kind of player you get jitters when they get the ball, do i get that kind of feeling when any one else on our team gets the ball, im afraid not.
That for me makes the games quite boring, been thinking this way since Wayne took over, yes its good to win but its better to win in style, similar can be said of losing.
These are just my own opinions, different people like to see different things.
I said to my son after 10 minutes l couldn’t see a try in us. French aside we don’t have players who can make something happen on a regular basis.
I don’t think it’s unrealistic to expect us to have 2 or 3 players that can create something (whether that be an opening for a try or just a bit of excitement). Players like French with genuine speed, a prop that can break through tackles or a halfback with some guile.
During 40 years of watching Wigan I have seen some dire games but as far as I can remember I haven’t seen a Wigan team that has frustrated and bored me as much as the one on Saturday.
To end on a positive, we can only improve. Can’t we?????
