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Thanks for the compliment cp

josie andrews wrote:DaveO, in Kris Radlinski's book he touches on how 'the culture of the club has eroded' over the years.



This is just a paragraph and it goes on to give an example, but you will have to wait until June and buy the book, you will be amazed with how honest he is about the club he loves.

Well it just goes to show the perception of the fans is not that far off sometimes.

It may be easier to foster this sort of culture from a position of success but lets not forget Wigan started on the road to success from division 2. So it had to start right form being down in the dumps.

The John Monie "stand on the wing with a broken leg" and Edwards playing with a fractured eye socket seems worlds away at the moment.

Maybe it's all got too technical and Nobbie thinks setting a game plan is all there is too it. If they players follow it, they win if thy don't they lose and that is all there is too it seems to be how it is. None of this never say die attitude. Some players seem to have it like previous posts mentioned - as said this is why we have taken to the young players so readily but the risk is it seeps out of them in the face of a more general malaise.

Dave

Good post elegro,
What I cannot understand is where all the money is going to for the first team squad and wherever the kitty goes to!
We have got the standard money that the RL hand out each season, yeh.
Then we are allowed to spend a certain amount of "Gate" money that us supporters put through the turnstiles, yeh.
Plus any other sundries.

We are the second best supported team in Super League so the percentage of monies available is alot better than say 85% of Super League teams. Why can we not attract the cream of RL who want to play for Wigan.
I know we are holding on to our youngsters now, which is a relief, and the bedrock of future teams, but why has there been panic buying of Aussies to top up the squad?
Leeds have a good sound footing of up and coming players, St Helens have a good squad who seem to enjoy their rugby (how they pay them all and keep such a good side is anyones guess apart from having a succession of good coaches)
Why should we put up with mediocrity
With the money available WE should be at the top of the tree, as someone else has pointed out, to play with pride in the shirt and put your life on the line should be the norm (All the Wigan home grown players have that desire) + Leului + Richards +Carmont.
I want good entertaining rugby in exchange for the trust that I gave WRLFC by buying my season ticket I will not accept anything less, be it the Coach, Mr Lenigan's or the Players fault. Someone has got to be shown the door, the sooner the better, you should not lose your first 3 games against smaller clubs with a lot less revenue and smaller squads. Rant over!

PS Oh no its not! Those people who say that "We are notorious slow starters"?
What is that all about?
I'll tell you what! I'll pay for my season ticket 5 or 6 matches in when WRLFC decide to turn up, and pay accordingly.
GET IT SORTED Mr LENIGAN, AND MAKE IT FAST

Thats not true. There is a cap. Which is/was 1.8m. We didnt reach that according to Il and he blamed it on the sponsorship. Bare in mind Saints had a cracking sponsor, cup winning receipts and not bad attendances. So they could probably spend more than us.

mickh wrote:Good post elegro,
What I cannot understand is where all the money is going to for the first team squad and wherever the kitty goes to!
We have got the standard money that the RL hand out each season, yeh.
Then we are allowed to spend a certain amount of "Gate" money that us supporters put through the turnstiles, yeh.
Plus any other sundries.

We are the second best supported team in Super League so the percentage of monies available is alot better than say 85% of Super League teams. Why can we not attract the cream of RL who want to play for Wigan.
I know we are holding on to our youngsters now, which is a relief, and the bedrock of future teams, but why has there been panic buying of Aussies to top up the squad?
Leeds have a good sound footing of up and coming players, St Helens have a good squad who seem to enjoy their rugby (how they pay them all and keep such a good side is anyones guess apart from having a succession of good coaches)
Why should we put up with mediocrity
With the money available WE should be at the top of the tree, as someone else has pointed out, to play with pride in the shirt and put your life on the line should be the norm (All the Wigan home grown players have that desire) + Leului + Richards +Carmont.
I want good entertaining rugby in exchange for the trust that I gave WRLFC by buying my season ticket I will not accept anything less, be it the Coach, Mr Lenigan's or the Players fault. Someone has got to be shown the door, the sooner the better, you should not lose your first 3 games against smaller clubs with a lot less revenue and smaller squads. Rant over!

PS Oh no its not! Those people who say that "We are notorious slow starters"?
What is that all about?
I'll tell you what! I'll pay for my season ticket 5 or 6 matches in when WRLFC decide to turn up, and pay accordingly.
GET IT SORTED Mr LENIGAN, AND MAKE IT FAST

I agree with a lot of this but Salary cap is the same for all sides now is it not?

Hello gpartin, If it has altered I will stand corrected, but it seems a very Communistic way of doing things if it has.
Where does all the "gate" money go to then?

We pay rent for the ground which according to IL is a very good deal and there are costs such as non playing staff, transport/accomodation/clothing/food etc etc for the players/staff. Even so I agree with you Mick.

mickh wrote:Hello gpartin, If it has altered I will stand corrected, but it seems a very Communistic way of doing things if it has.
Where does all the "gate" money go to then?

I think so too Mick, I'm not 100% sure of the details of the cap, I lost interest when it changed.

What doesn't help under any cap is when the players on the most money don't perform... they should be showing the youngsters what they need to be like as players and what attitude they need to show in order to earn the kind of money they get. If this is happening at Wigan now then I'm the Queen of Sheba.

Therein lies the crux. It is the established expensive players that have failed Wigan in recent seasons. How can 3 carries Fielden help O'C or Prekky?

elgrego wrote:I don't think it's a case of comparisons to the glory years but we have, as a result of those years and before then, come to expect certain things from any player that pulls on a Wigan shirt.

Rightly or wrongly, we expect players to display certain attributes regardless of their age, position, reputation, injury, background etc. We expect, more so than any other club in my opinion, players to display absolute loyalty and passion, unswerving commitment to their team-mates, dedication and professionalism. We expect them to put their body on the line - was it Shaun Edwards or Dean Bell who said that the only valid excuse for not being in the defensive line was having a broken leg?

Similarly we have come to expect certain attributes/qualities from certian positions (to list just a few):

• full-backs without fear (Radlinski, Hampson)
  fast, agile, strong and confident wingers (Robinson, Gill, Ferguson, Dallas)
  centres with speed, superb hands and strong tackling (Miles, Connolly, Bell)
  clever, confident half-backs who control and dictate the game (Edwards, Lam, Gregory, Barrett)
  fearless, hard-as-iron prop forwards (Skerrett, O'Connor, Smith)
  crafty hookers (Newton, Dermott)
  hard-running, ball-handling, tackle-all-day 2nd rowers (Cassidy, Hock(!), Betts)
  creative, classy and dominant loose forwards (farrell and hanley)

I think that's why, when we see players, like Ainscough and Tomkins displaying the qualities that we have come to expect, we respond to them so well and when we see players not displaying these attributes (Mathers, Tim Smith...I won't go on) we dismiss them as not good enough for Wigan.

I don't know whether it's right or wrong that we should expect all of this from our players but it certainly heaps a whole load of pressure on them! See Fielden's recent comments.

one of the best posts i have ever read on this site - welcome to the boards elgrego! I'm only posting on the tread to commend you as i need not really add anything to what you have said.