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cpwigan wrote:Daryl Goulding was enthusiastic and buzzing when he first came in, wonder what happened? I think players are scorned for being so, Ainscough celebrating tries has been dampened down considerably. Why?

Webby1971 wrote:I know this may not be a popular thread because this lad is exactly what we need to build for the future and everyone is singing his praises BUT at the moment he may have scored 9 tries but how many has he cost us. He really does need to tone up on his loose ball / high ball takes and his positioning, I would even go as far as to say that in defence he is a liabilty and if I was the oppossing playmaker would pepper him with high balls and grubbers. Over to you Radders. As for Tompkins, for once tonight I agree with Stevo, he needs to take the defence on more, BUT I don't blame him, I believe he is being surpressed by Nobles gameplan, let the lad loose for gods sake.

RJ wrote:

jaws1 wrote:They are bound to make mistakes as they are both on a learning curve personally i would put up with this they have both brought a fresh impetus into the team.It is up to the coaching staff to iron out the mistakes.

Spot on! We could do with more of their enthusiasm and less of the apparent lethargy which runs through some of the team.

MrDave wrote:

cpwigan wrote:Daryl Goulding was enthusiastic and buzzing when he first came in, wonder what happened? I think players are scorned for being so, Ainscough celebrating tries has been dampened down considerably. Why?

When a young player is brought into the first team they usually have a period were they are playing on 'youthful enthusiasm' but eventually they step up to Super League and the increased demand of the first team catches up with them.

Darrell Goulding came into the squad and had a very good try scoring record coming off the bench but he struggled playing the full 80 and other teams found his weaknesses. Ainscough is probably finding super league a bit tougher, when he came into the squad a lot of players were caught out by his speed and upper body strength but now teams are aware of this and are finding his weaknesses as well.

cpwigan wrote:Excellent post Webby and bags of truth in it. I made similar posts I guess before Ainscough was selected and soon after. In a sense I will add to what Eclipse said.

Young players do not progress as they should at Wigan RLFC.

Shaun Ainscough.

Every weakness he has now, he had when he signed as a 16 year old and not a thing was done or has been done.

Firstly he is a right winger not a left winger. People may say that should not make a difference but it does to a certain extent. His scooting is certainly hampered by it.

Secondly. He was left far far too long in the Academy Team. Until the very end of last season he had spent virtually the whole of his Wigan career in the academy team. Now if people think reserves does not prepare players for SL, imagine Academy RL. His break came when he got selected for England v Aus. He played in the second game and had a brilliant game. Liam Farrell was also excellent. He came back and based on that single game in Aus, somebody somewhere at Wigan after leaving him in the academy for 2 possibly 3 years decided he was suddenly good enough for reserve RL.

Every weakness you see has been there for 3 years. Fielding kicks? Wigan lost a great Academy Derby when he failed to deal with a kick. Defensively, being keen he overreads in defence, Riley from Warrington gave him the run around because he did so in a reserve match when chasing kicks.

He's actually improved and is making rapid progress now that he is in SL. He has no choice. Being a big headed know it all I send him advice periodically. Whether he reads it who knows / cares but I said before Saints it was vital he stuck with his winger when playing v Gidley. He did that superbly IMO. He was not to blame when Gidley scored BTW. I was shocked Saints did not target him with kicks. Ultimately his strength far outweigh his weaknesses and those can be worked on with some coaching.

I also contacted Mick Hogan to say the club should really work on his literacy skills. I believe clubs should develop players both as players and as people.

Sam Tomkins.

He works non stop with extras developing his skill levels. Like many youngsters having seen him playing in schoolyards his talent etc was/is superb. Joel / Liam Farrell are both great rugby players.

If Sam had his way he would be buzzing around the ball non stop but you have to appreciate for whatever reason that is not the Noble way. Both half backs go from tackle 1 out wide and next to their centre. That leaves them virtually with 1 play, feed the centre.

Worse, Sam is far far better on the left side. If you recall his break v Quins when he came on as sub it was playing left side. Again yes he can play both sides but he's far better / comfortable on the left. He scored what 30 odd tries last season and I bet 20+ were on the left stepping back inside. It was his party piece. His other party piece was the chip kick / grubber and collect from 30-50 yards out. Have you noticed how all the things that made poeople sit up an take notice tend to get coached out of players the higher they climb.

I have to say defensively he has done far better than I envisaged.

Do players look better or worse at Wigan or at a new club?

Here is an example of how stupid Wigan RLFC is. Remember last season Joel Tomkins scored afew tries from grubbers put through for him by Tim Smith at the time. Tim does not really matter. The way Joel runs at the line, flat makes that grubber work perfectly. Come this season what happened? A move that worked regularly has been dispensed with. Now from where I am watching Wigan RLFC do not have enough scoring moves to throw away the few they actually have.

OAM wrote: Ainscough will always be suseptable unber the high balls bombed to him out wide as he is only a small lad but he will get better and better as time goes by. You can see when he plays he gives 100% and that is all i and many more will ask of him

turf wrote:

cpwigan wrote:Excellent post Webby and bags of truth in it. I made similar posts I guess before Ainscough was selected and soon after. In a sense I will add to what Eclipse said.

Young players do not progress as they should at Wigan RLFC.

Shaun Ainscough.

Every weakness he has now, he had when he signed as a 16 year old and not a thing was done or has been done.

Firstly he is a right winger not a left winger. People may say that should not make a difference but it does to a certain extent. His scooting is certainly hampered by it.

Secondly. He was left far far too long in the Academy Team. Until the very end of last season he had spent virtually the whole of his Wigan career in the academy team. Now if people think reserves does not prepare players for SL, imagine Academy RL. His break came when he got selected for England v Aus. He played in the second game and had a brilliant game. Liam Farrell was also excellent. He came back and based on that single game in Aus, somebody somewhere at Wigan after leaving him in the academy for 2 possibly 3 years decided he was suddenly good enough for reserve RL.

Every weakness you see has been there for 3 years. Fielding kicks? Wigan lost a great Academy Derby when he failed to deal with a kick. Defensively, being keen he overreads in defence, Riley from Warrington gave him the run around because he did so in a reserve match when chasing kicks.

He's actually improved and is making rapid progress now that he is in SL. He has no choice. Being a big headed know it all I send him advice periodically. Whether he reads it who knows / cares but I said before Saints it was vital he stuck with his winger when playing v Gidley. He did that superbly IMO. He was not to blame when Gidley scored BTW. I was shocked Saints did not target him with kicks. Ultimately his strength far outweigh his weaknesses and those can be worked on with some coaching.

I also contacted Mick Hogan to say the club should really work on his literacy skills. I believe clubs should develop players both as players and as people.

Sam Tomkins.

He works non stop with extras developing his skill levels. Like many youngsters having seen him playing in schoolyards his talent etc was/is superb. Joel / Liam Farrell are both great rugby players.

If Sam had his way he would be buzzing around the ball non stop but you have to appreciate for whatever reason that is not the Noble way. Both half backs go from tackle 1 out wide and next to their centre. That leaves them virtually with 1 play, feed the centre.

Worse, Sam is far far better on the left side. If you recall his break v Quins when he came on as sub it was playing left side. Again yes he can play both sides but he's far better / comfortable on the left. He scored what 30 odd tries last season and I bet 20+ were on the left stepping back inside. It was his party piece. His other party piece was the chip kick / grubber and collect from 30-50 yards out. Have you noticed how all the things that made poeople sit up an take notice tend to get coached out of players the higher they climb.

I have to say defensively he has done far better than I envisaged.

Do players look better or worse at Wigan or at a new club?

Here is an example of how stupid Wigan RLFC is. Remember last season Joel Tomkins scored afew tries from grubbers put through for him by Tim Smith at the time. Tim does not really matter. The way Joel runs at the line, flat makes that grubber work perfectly. Come this season what happened? A move that worked regularly has been dispensed with. Now from where I am watching Wigan RLFC do not have enough scoring moves to throw away the few they actually have.

You know Ainscough then cpwigan? Ainscough doesn't look bgheaded to me. A bit harsh to say he overruns the defensive line, but I know what you are saying, and with Radders by his side, he will learn fast.

He looks quick, keen and enthusiastic to learn which can only benefit him when he is being taught by Radders.

He must read your advice cpwigan, otherwise he wouldn't be contunuing to improve game by game, training session by training session.

He was also not to blame when the kick off went out against Saints on Thursday, and Catalan last night.

Also, it depends what family background he is from, because they must also be doing their best to keep his feet firmly on the floor, because he doesn't look to be getting carried away does he?