Sam v Shaun

[ian.birchall]

My fondest memory of Shaun Edwards is his first Test match against the convicts when he started at Elland Road. Wally Lewis had made fools of us all in the first two matches, in the third I can remember the aussies passing the ball out along their 3/4s and onto Lewis who was just about to break us open once again and as he received the ball was flattened by Edwards and lost the ball, I still remember the look on his face 'where did he come from?', for two tests nobody had laid a finger on him, Edwards watched the aussie attack develop, he knew exactly where the ball was going and he got there at the same time as Lewis received the ball, nobody else in that international side had anything like the game vision and nous (even at 19/20) that Edwards had all his career.

[yoda warrior]

This might sound daft but Sam's abilities are beginning to scare me!
Against Wire when he chipped through to King, he knew King would get that ball but he'd already calculated that if he got in quick, he could maybe make King drop the ball for Lockers to pick up.

Against Hull, he pushed other Wiganers out of the way to be receiver from Lockers because he could see the gaps in the broken play and he had to have that ball. Ten seconds later, the match was over.
I've watched Wigan since the 1960s and I've seen no-one, not even Edwards, who had such a combination of talents. Speed, ball handling, unbelievable balance, determination AND a brain that seems to work twice as fast as anybody else's. That's not to put Sean Edwards down - the guy was phenomenal and a joy to watch - but this lad I think is unique. If he stays fit, there is no real limit to what he can do. Other teams try to flatten him or shut him down but they're wasting their time.

My brother in law, who's an exiled Wiganer and a big fan of both codes, reckons that there's no union player in Europe that can match him and that Wasps would offer £500,000 tomorrow if they thought they had a chance.

He's developing that Slater-esque instinct to see an opposition mistake as a chance for him to score a try.

[cpwigan]

I am a huge Sam fan but the comparison as many have said is silly and unfair. At the present time Sam is light years from Edwards.

Ted Mac I would say a young Kiwi fullback we signed from Trinity was even better on his feet, balance and more naturally gifted; a young Henry Paul.

[TedMac]

Good point cp. I watched Henry playing for Trinity at Central Park and he was a revelation. Think he's the only Wigan player I've seen who dropped-out from the goal line, chased his kick, caught it and scored.
Time will tell re Sam but I think his armoury will just keep growing.

[pedro]

Good point cp. I watched Henry playing for Trinity at Central Park and he was a revelation. Think he's the only Wigan player I've seen who dropped-out from the goal line, chased his kick, caught it and scored.
Time will tell re Sam but I think his armoury will just keep growing.

Faz dropped out, Paul was at least 5 yards offside, I remember him beating us at central park on his own for wakefield. We signed him the same year.

[Welski]

Wasps would offer £500,000 tomorrow if they thought they had a chance

Sam must already be in the minds of union clubs. If Chris Aston continues to shine for England at the up coming ru world cup it will make him even hotter property.
What do we think are the chances of him crossing codes? Sorry if it's a little of topic but I could argue Shaun ultimately left so it is a comparison of sorts!

[Panchitta Marra]

I would have to disagree PM re Edwards and Sam at halfback. Edwards was a general able to lead his troops and control the game. Sam has not shown that ability as yet. Kicking wise, I think Sam potentially could kick longer but Edwards was a far better kicker in terms of finding the ground etc. The player that reminds me of Edwards the halfback is Finch. Edwards like Finch would stand left and dart right at the last moment to create 4 v 3s or 3 v 2s and would make those fantastic delayed short passes. Defensively, Edwards was a master at reading the game and he could even leave the line to kill passing moves etc. Edwards and Phil Clarke were the best players I have seen at doing so. You have a player in Edwards who was groomed by a father in Jackie who but for injury was not far behind Alex Murphy in ability. Edwards was educated akin to the most intense Aus RL players in the ways of RL.

Sam T IMO is a better athlete hence why he is suited more to FB than Edwards was but here lies the problem comparing. Edwards had some awful injuries that hampered his speed but that season I alluded to he was fabulous athletically. IMO, he never reached those heights athletically again. Sam is not going to be like he is forever and hopefully he will then be able to slot into a halfback role at that stage.

Finchy was a lot more evasive and athletic in his early career. Even CPW was (JK) Shit happ[ens and as we age we expand and slow no matter how fit we are.

I understand what you are saying CP, however, there are very few times I can recollect seeing Edwards beat a man, even one onto one where Sam does it for fun. Surely this is an essential attribute of a top Stand Off.
Sam's chip over the top and collect are out of this world, again something I seldom saw Shaun doing.
Sam has not yet had chance to prove his ability at 6, and to be honest the way Finchy has been playing there has been no need.
Shaun was the worlds best at following a move knowing exactly when and where to be on the end of that final pass, but that doesnt necessarily mean he was a better stand off.
Sam's allround play whether we feel he is a better 1 or 6, IMO is well above that Edwards produced.

[Welski]

Just to add another dimention to the debate...anyone agree that Kris R was a better full back than either of them?

[cpwigan]

Edwards beat men PM but as a half back his primary job was supplying others. He had a very good chip and chase too. Again it is not something you use too much whether you are Sam or Shaun. Passing to men in a gap, directing teams around Edwards was in a different class to Sam but that time may come later in his career. In a previous post I mentioned a young Henry Paul, a young Henry was a very different player to the Henry post 26 years old. They may as well have been different players. A young Henry was even better than Sam in terms of balance and evasion BUT he was a very inferior half back to Old Henry, hence he played FB a lot like Sam is now doing.

[cpwigan]

Just to add another dimention to the debate...anyone agree that Kris R was a better full back than either of them?

I think Kris was a great seervant to the club but somebody who achieved what he did despite of not being blessed with supreme talents. Attitude and effort over skills.