Re: Lenagan

[No straw damn us]

Lenagan HAS to run the club as a business. Under Whelan and Lindsey we had three players taking up half of the salary cap and some young first team players earning less than £8K per year. Lenagan has stabilised the club and brought success back.
He should be aiming for Wigan to make a profit or at least break even and we shouldn't expect him to have to subsidise the club for long periods.

I think IL has done a lot for us re: the business side of things the problem is with that is how does IL define a successful season, good performances on the pitch or good performances in the books?. They arent mutually exclusive concepts but you get the feeling as long as we finish in the black to IL it doesnt matter where we finish in the league.

Since Lenagan took over 10 years ago Wigan have reached three Challenge Cup finals, five grand finals, two league leaders and a World Club Challenge. In the last seven years they have not finished outside the top four, this year may be different. With the exception of Leeds that is the best record in the comp and look where they finished last year!!

That doesn't tie up with your statement does it? in that time there were years when wigan made a profit but also lost money.

I'll post this link AGAIN so perhaps people may understand.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... ng-history

[Wigan_forever1985]

Lenagan HAS to run the club as a business. Under Whelan and Lindsey we had three players taking up half of the salary cap and some young first team players earning less than £8K per year. Lenagan has stabilised the club and brought success back.
He should be aiming for Wigan to make a profit or at least break even and we shouldn't expect him to have to subsidise the club for long periods.

I think IL has done a lot for us re: the business side of things the problem is with that is how does IL define a successful season, good performances on the pitch or good performances in the books?. They arent mutually exclusive concepts but you get the feeling as long as we finish in the black to IL it doesnt matter where we finish in the league.

Since Lenagan took over 10 years ago Wigan have reached three Challenge Cup finals, five grand finals, two league leaders and a World Club Challenge. In the last seven years they have not finished outside the top four, this year may be different. With the exception of Leeds that is the best record in the comp and look where they finished last year!!

That doesn't tie up with your statement does it? in that time there were years when wigan made a profit but also lost money.

I'll post this link AGAIN so perhaps people may understand.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... ng-history

The statement comes for 2 reasons

1 - during this period you talk of the squad has been consistently thinned in terms of quality. Yes he has spent money on George and Sam but Sam was a huge risk. The squad consistently looks more like a youth team year on year.

2 - Where is the admission from IL that this season has simply not been good enough, other owners come out and speak when the sides have slumped, whether that be a rallying cry of hope or a condemming view on the current set up. The few snippets i have seen from IL he seems to think we've done alright this season because we've got to the CC Final.

The sad truth is i think much of the disgruntlement many feel (myself included) is more at the state of rugby league in general . Do any of the trophies mean that much anymore?, we can still mathematically win the GF this year. That says to me that there is absolutely no value in being champions because we have been shocking all season.

Maybe I'm just losing my love for the game, but it all just seems a bit pointless, you've got people like TBW who solely look at trophies as a measure of success, which is fine and theres a strong argument for his claim, but if the trophy can still be won by being absolutely terrible for 95% of the season - what is it actually worth?

I can't think of a season in which Wigan have been so hard to watch, yet like i say we could still be champions, despite the 100 year record for no wins and despite the terrible conversation rate and leaky defence. Despite the fact we are a chore to watch.

We probably won't win, but the very fact we still can is ridiculous

[Wandering Warrior]

promotes the sport. holding outside the heartland of RL is good. helps promote the club to a new audience and helps money come into the club

So you're off to Oz for a home match then?
As I said, dreaming narcisist.

Maybe im just one of these arm chair supporters...
or maybe if i didn't have a young child i would have been yes.

Wigan has set up a sponsors club in london yes?

neutral have shown interest in exhibition matches so its all down if its held at a decent location.

like it or not More people will visit the south of england on holiday from places like Aus and NZ who may attend that will come visit some Damp filled ex Mining town in the north west.

but (and this isn't aimed at just you WW) as i don't agree with Majority just call me a happy clapper and move on

do people honestly believe Lenagan would be doing these things if it didn't make the club money? you cannot call him a tight fisted business man unwilling to put hand in pocket on one subject and then completely contract yourselves in the next thread... oooo his moving it away from wigan... no ones going to attend,what a waster of money

again not aimed at you in particular

I can take any comments, it's water off a duck's back. However as has been previously been said, Wigan Warriors is Wigan Warriors in Wigan, whatever the business or dreaming side of the owner is?

[Caboosegg]

So you're off to Oz for a home match then?
As I said, dreaming narcisist.

Maybe im just one of these arm chair supporters...
or maybe if i didn't have a young child i would have been yes.

Wigan has set up a sponsors club in london yes?

neutral have shown interest in exhibition matches so its all down if its held at a decent location.

like it or not More people will visit the south of england on holiday from places like Aus and NZ who may attend that will come visit some Damp filled ex Mining town in the north west.

but (and this isn't aimed at just you WW) as i don't agree with Majority just call me a happy clapper and move on

do people honestly believe Lenagan would be doing these things if it didn't make the club money? you cannot call him a tight fisted business man unwilling to put hand in pocket on one subject and then completely contract yourselves in the next thread... oooo his moving it away from wigan... no ones going to attend,what a waster of money

again not aimed at you in particular

I can take any comments, it's water off a duck's back. However as has been previously been said, Wigan Warriors is Wigan Warriors in Wigan, whatever the business or dreaming side of the owner is?

a club cannot survive of just Wigan though. i would never support wigan moving from Wigan however the odd Exhibition game here and there each year helps increase the clubs profile.

RL will never manage it to the same extent as football, but look at what happens there, clubs go to other countries and hold matches in different parts of the country and as such have a larger fan base and imagine. purley on the business side as well i'd expect sponsers are more likely to invest if they are getting a wider audience.

however i would be very disappointed if the match is held at a nowhere club (much like milward) you'd hope that IL with the RFL would be trying to get somewhere bigger (wembley at a pipe dream) as match by ANY club like this are a chance to promote the game.

[Wiganer Ted]

IL won't be complacent it's not his nature.
The WCC is great and to be in the C Cup final is excellent.
However, season ticket holders are the financial backbone of the club and this season's Super League performance has been below average.
Sometimes good other times abysmal. 10 wins out of 24 games isn't good enough.
What effect it will have on next season's season ticket sales is anyone's guess. IL will be watching that from day one.
If we are to improve then changes have to be made to get that improvement. Whether that's improved quality player signings or improved coaching appointments next season's games have to improve as an entertainment, rugby quality and better win ratio.
That's not forgetting possible finals and trophies.

[pedro]

this year wane could win as more than madge did in his second year and won the same last year, yet people did slag him off....funny that, this isnt football there are 2 domestic trophies we are in the final of 1 and have probably just missed out on the other, bear in mind Leeds won it from 5th and if it would have been top 8 this year we might have, never know eh

[Wandering Warrior]

Maybe im just one of these arm chair supporters...
or maybe if i didn't have a young child i would have been yes.

Wigan has set up a sponsors club in london yes?

neutral have shown interest in exhibition matches so its all down if its held at a decent location.

like it or not More people will visit the south of england on holiday from places like Aus and NZ who may attend that will come visit some Damp filled ex Mining town in the north west.

but (and this isn't aimed at just you WW) as i don't agree with Majority just call me a happy clapper and move on

do people honestly believe Lenagan would be doing these things if it didn't make the club money? you cannot call him a tight fisted business man unwilling to put hand in pocket on one subject and then completely contract yourselves in the next thread... oooo his moving it away from wigan... no ones going to attend,what a waster of money

again not aimed at you in particular

I can take any comments, it's water off a duck's back. However as has been previously been said, Wigan Warriors is Wigan Warriors in Wigan, whatever the business or dreaming side of the owner is?

a club cannot survive of just Wigan though. i would never support wigan moving from Wigan however the odd Exhibition game here and there each year helps increase the clubs profile.

RL will never manage it to the same extent as football, but look at what happens there, clubs go to other countries and hold matches in different parts of the country and as such have a larger fan base and imagine. purley on the business side as well i'd expect sponsers are more likely to invest if they are getting a wider audience.

however i would be very disappointed if the match is held at a nowhere club (much like milward) you'd hope that IL with the RFL would be trying to get somewhere bigger (wembley at a pipe dream) as match by ANY club like this are a chance to promote the game.

I'm not talking about exhibition matches I'm bothered about Super League home matches purposely played away from Wigan.
Interesting you bring up football and in the Premiership teams play loads of their home matches away from their own grounds?! The next one will be the first!!

[pedro]

I can take any comments, it's water off a duck's back. However as has been previously been said, Wigan Warriors is Wigan Warriors in Wigan, whatever the business or dreaming side of the owner is?

a club cannot survive of just Wigan though. i would never support wigan moving from Wigan however the odd Exhibition game here and there each year helps increase the clubs profile.

RL will never manage it to the same extent as football, but look at what happens there, clubs go to other countries and hold matches in different parts of the country and as such have a larger fan base and imagine. purley on the business side as well i'd expect sponsers are more likely to invest if they are getting a wider audience.

however i would be very disappointed if the match is held at a nowhere club (much like milward) you'd hope that IL with the RFL would be trying to get somewhere bigger (wembley at a pipe dream) as match by ANY club like this are a chance to promote the game.

I'm not talking about exhibition matches I'm bothered about Super League home matches purposely played away from Wigan.
Interesting you bring up football and in the Premiership teams play loads of their home matches away from their own grounds?! The next one will be the first!!

he never said that

[morley pie eater]

I've said it before that imo Lenagan is not a patch on our previous Directors.

Can you imagaine Hilton, Rathbone,Robinson,Lindsey or even Wheelan putting up with this shower?

Maybe time for a change at the very top?

When I see those names ( not including) Whelan) I see inovation and vision moving the club forward building on our heritage.I think Lenaghan is trying to do the same.

So which of these previous directors got the club in debt, leading to the sale of Central Park? £2 million for a new stand, £450,000 for Offish when crowds had peaked. Mmmm . . . None of them blameless, I'd say.

Now remind me again, what is it that IL has done?

[morley pie eater]

I know it's par for the course with internet forums but to be honest I'm staggered by the overwhelming negativity, all stemming from a comment that our chairman 'would like to' play the New Zealand Warriors in London. Nothing has even been confirmed and yet people are complaining that he doesn't care about the fans.

It will be the same fans who moan when we announce a new kit sponsor and say 'is that the best we can do?'. The same fans who moan when we make signings that seem underwhelming because Super League struggles to attract the big names these days.

Some rugby league fans just aren't happy unless they're unhappy.

There's an obvious reason why Ian Lenagan is wanting to host games overseas, and games in the capital. It's for sponsorship. Rugby league struggles to attract enough investment and one of the main reasons is the parochial nature of the sport.

Sponsorship opportunities in the north of England are limited, that's why the business club was set up in London. The sport is still niche in this country, but it's a billion dollar industry in Australia, hence why we're trying to tap into that market.

The biggest sports have global appeal, the biggest sports franchises have global appeal.

The NFL now host matches in Wembley. Perhaps the fans of those teams are furious when they find there's a home match being held in a different continent that they can't go to watch, but there's a reason why the NFL do it. It brings in money. It brings in sponsors. In provides exposure.

Now it's always a risk that we might not gain much from our venture down under or, if it were to happen, a one off game against NZ Warriors in London, but bloody hell a forward thinking club needs to be trying these things! We know damn well that the RFL haven't got a clue what their strategy is to grow the sport, to bring in more money which the game desperately needs.

Our chairman is clearly chasing sponsorship opportunities that could increase the profile of both the club and the sport, make it more attractive to investors, give the game the global appeal that it lacks at the moment but could easily have with the right time and the right ideas.

Seriously, he's mentioned ONE GAME that he'd like played in London, and chances are it would be a pre-season game and most people don't turn up to those anyway! If it was a choice between a pre-season game away at Workington, that most fans could, but probably wouldn't, turn up to, or a game held in London attempting to sell the sport to those who might be willing to put some money into it, I'd rather have the latter.

As for the criticism of Lenagan regarding the performances this season, I don't think anyone should be immune from criticism, not even someone who I think has done and continues to do an excellent job in making the club sustainable, but I don't see a reason for him to comment. Performances haven't been great, admittedly, but we've got one trophy this year and are in the final for another. IF we were to win the challenge cup that satisfies the target set of winning one trophy per year (the WCC is more of a bonus). To be honest at the start of the year I'd have taken a cup win so I'm not feeling too disheartened, just a bit disappointed with the lack of entertainment on the field.

We've been in situations in the past where coaches have been sacked for being 3rd or 4th in the table. Thank god those days are gone. We've won numerous trophies since Lenagan came to the club and since Wane took charge. Of course Lenagan isn't going to sack Shaun Wane when we're in the final of the Challenge Cup and, somehow, still capable of reaching the top 4.

Coaches who win trophies will obviously be given more time to try to rectify problems and will be given patience. Look at Leeds. They went from champions to middle 8's and now they could easily become champions again. McDermott has had his critics for years, sometimes it's impossible to win people over, even with success, but I best most at Leeds are happy that the club stuck by him.

Lenagan will not make snap judgements, especially not when it's still mathematically possible (if very unlikely) for the club to win the double. If we were in Warrington's shoes, perhaps things would be looking a little less certain for our coach, but they aren't.

I'm not a Wane cheerleader. I'm sometimes critical and sometimes positive, but I just don't see how he the chairman could sack our coach in the current circumstances and have it seen as a sensible move. It would be a move from the Whelan/Lindsay era, and thankfully that's well behind us. If it means thinks happen a little slower, then that's fine by me as long as the club remains healthy on the field and continues to challenge for trophies.

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