Should Joel be Sacked?

[Wigan_forever1985]

Most other teams fans say he's done wrong, apologised and been fined and banned. End of.

Its only Wigan fans who want him sacked as he's not been good enough since his return, and therefore an easy option to get rid.

What would be the outcome if it was Lockers or Farrell ?

Sack them, don't give a shite who the player is, no player is bigger than the club, he would have been out of the under former owners, letting him off with a short ban and a fine just shows current and future players they can get away with what ever they like

So have you never made a grave mistake?

I was shocked & appalled when it all eventually surfaced but it’s been dealt with by the club, he’s apologised. It won’t be the first & won’t be the last.

If it wasn’t a Wigan RL player but ordinary Joe Public there wouldn’t have been all this outcry! Probably just two measly lines in a local paper!

Think it’s been blown out of all proportion now!

Let’s move on.

Problem is Josie this vein of thought is normally rooted in the "they are just normal humans prone to mistakes" the issue i take with this, is that "normal" people wouldnt be afforded the lets move on attitude. The closest you can get to a "normal" joe publiv as you say in this situation is for example an nurse or policeman/woman acting like this wearing a uniform - because thats what these lads are doing whether they are casually drinking with friends or on the pitch they are wearing a Wigan uniform. Thats why they get paid so much, with that mass of money has to come extra responsibilities "joe public" doesnt have

If you make mistakes you pay for them - to me giving him a month off and a fine he probably wont pay isnt to me paying for it

[Warrior20]

I struggle to see how Wigan can keep him. A few other fans I have spoken to don't want to see him in a Wigan shirt again, I agree with them to be honest. If the fans aren't happy to see him playing, they will make there feelings known, putting pressure on the club to respond. I'm sure Widnes or Salford would pick him up if Wigan sacked him.

[medlocke]

Most other teams fans say he's done wrong, apologised and been fined and banned. End of.

Its only Wigan fans who want him sacked as he's not been good enough since his return, and therefore an easy option to get rid.

What would be the outcome if it was Lockers or Farrell ?

Sack them, don't give a shite who the player is, no player is bigger than the club, he would have been out of the under former owners, letting him off with a short ban and a fine just shows current and future players they can get away with what ever they like

So have you never made a grave mistake?

I was shocked & appalled when it all eventually surfaced but it’s been dealt with by the club, he’s apologised. It won’t be the first & won’t be the last.

If it wasn’t a Wigan RL player but ordinary Joe Public there wouldn’t have been all this outcry! Probably just two measly lines in a local paper!

Think it’s been blown out of all proportion now!

Let’s move on.

No, i'm perfect

[moto748]

I don't care what fans of other teams think, that's not the issue. I care how the club acts, and any suggestions that JT would be hard done by if sacked doesn't stand up for a moment for me. As has been pointed out, if Joe Public had done this, plenty would have been sacked by their employers instantly, whether it made headlines in the papers or not.

"Suppose it was Lockers or Faz?" It wasn't. Wondering about hypotheticals gets us nowhere. We can only deal with the facts as they are, not what might have been.

[jobo]

Maybe I could add my sixpennurth. It probably is a sackable offence but this would leave JT & more importantly his family in a bad way. He is 29, a lot of years in front of him. Why did he do it? Because he was drunk but why was he drunk. The reason why I drank in excess was because of work related stress. When work stopped I stopped the excess drinking. He probably needs help, but I think he needs to move on as well. I dont think the drink is part of RL culture argument stands-Ellery didnt drink, I dont think Isa drinks. By way of being positive, I think Rads should give a call to the owner of Toulouse Olympic. They are a go ahead Club, building a new stadium. Eddy Pettybourne plays from them. They may well end up in SL but not yet. This would get JT out of English RL for a while and he would have his brother & family down the road an hour away. Incidently I heard that Wakefield so called fans were going to get some Rectum of Wigan Banners for Thursday. Things must be pretty dire over the breakfast table at JT Towers at the moment. Lets try & do the best for him his family, the Club & RL

Well said robbobillinge and also bill.inger.

[Lazy J]

NO

This is in danger of becoming a witch hunt, yes his behaviour was unacceptable, and hopefully he is rightly embarrassed, but action has been taken, he has been suspended and fined, move on. The real problem here is trial by media, if there wasn’t a video of it, it would have blown over by now.
Alcohol is a problem, but there are other issues, how was he allowed to get so drunk on licensed premises? The landlord and staff have a legal responsibility to stop serving him if he is visibly inebriated, this may have been what started the incident, I don’t know, does anyone? All we have seen are the 2 videos that are the result, we don’t know what lead up to that point or the context. I’m not blaming the staff by the way, just trying to look at the different angles on this.

I did a quick Google search on drunk rugby players, and found this incident at Bath a month ago

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-un ... g-10346165

Basically 11 players on a “wind down” session organised by the club got drunk, streaked round the ground and hurled insults at George Ford, problem is he was hosting an event (a kicking clinic) for children whose parents had paid for them to attend.
It wasn’t videoed, so it never made anything other than a story in the mirror, No one got sacked, that happened on club premises, at a club event.

We can’t compare to other codes, but there are precedents look at Dec or Ant whichever one isn’t on TV at the moment, he was bladdered and drove, crashed his car, into an innocent passer-by, to me drink driving is infinitely worse than what Tomkins did, I didn’t see Matthew Right hosting a debate on whether he should be allowed on TV again. He admitted a problem, and will be a national treasure again this time next year.

People make mistakes, people get punished that’s the cycle, Tomkins isn’t a role model, he’s a rugby player (or not if you look at some people’s opinions) my son loves the rugby, but we’ve explained to him what Joel did and why it was bad, that’s my job as a parent, my son gets his moral standards from me, not the 13 players on a rugby field, he idolises them as young fans do, but it’s served a positive, my son is now anti-alcohol as he can see the effects it has on people, he’s only 11 so that may change, but that’s what need to monitor as a parent.

As someone else mentioned, this can very quickly become another Terry Newton, player ostracised for making a mistake, loses his lively hood and can’t support his family, we know how that ended.

This is a convenient way for some fans to try and get a player who is underperforming at the moment out so we can bring someone new in.

[SJ]

Getting sick of certain fans bringing up Flower, this is totally different to that incident, Flowers was a heat of the moment brain fart after getting smashed in the face with a forearm ffs, Sky didn't do Flower any favour's by only ever showing it in slow motion making it look way more badder than it was.

If the club want players to behave in the future then an example needs making of Joel, It's about time the boys club mentality was broken at club and players where accountable for their actions, Lenagan really needs to grow a set and do what's right for the club

Totally agree Meds.
3years in the Marines would help him to grow up gain self respect and more respect
For others
Those who say he made a mistake don't know the meaning of the concept He knew exactly what he was doing. The bar staff asked him to leave on several occasion to leave He didn't have the intelligence to go. He's an idiot and on reflection would not pass muster in the Marines Yo watch that video was a. Shock but some say sweep it under the carpet and let's move on. Wrong. It's not moving on at all Its excusing the inexcusable Get rid now. It's the only action to take and would send the right message. It's not as if the bar maid didn't warn him he was placing his career in Jeapody but being an idiot full of himself he took no notice. Stupid boy!

[josie andrews]

Sack them, don't give a shite who the player is, no player is bigger than the club, he would have been out of the under former owners, letting him off with a short ban and a fine just shows current and future players they can get away with what ever they like

So have you never made a grave mistake?

I was shocked & appalled when it all eventually surfaced but it’s been dealt with by the club, he’s apologised. It won’t be the first & won’t be the last.

If it wasn’t a Wigan RL player but ordinary Joe Public there wouldn’t have been all this outcry! Probably just two measly lines in a local paper!

Think it’s been blown out of all proportion now!

Let’s move on.

No, i'm perfect

Aye, alreet ????????

[josie andrews]

NO

This is in danger of becoming a witch hunt, yes his behaviour was unacceptable, and hopefully he is rightly embarrassed, but action has been taken, he has been suspended and fined, move on. The real problem here is trial by media, if there wasn’t a video of it, it would have blown over by now.
Alcohol is a problem, but there are other issues, how was he allowed to get so drunk on licensed premises? The landlord and staff have a legal responsibility to stop serving him if he is visibly inebriated, this may have been what started the incident, I don’t know, does anyone? All we have seen are the 2 videos that are the result, we don’t know what lead up to that point or the context. I’m not blaming the staff by the way, just trying to look at the different angles on this.

I did a quick Google search on drunk rugby players, and found this incident at Bath a month ago

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-un ... g-10346165

Basically 11 players on a “wind down” session organised by the club got drunk, streaked round the ground and hurled insults at George Ford, problem is he was hosting an event (a kicking clinic) for children whose parents had paid for them to attend.
It wasn’t videoed, so it never made anything other than a story in the mirror, No one got sacked, that happened on club premises, at a club event.

We can’t compare to other codes, but there are precedents look at Dec or Ant whichever one isn’t on TV at the moment, he was bladdered and drove, crashed his car, into an innocent passer-by, to me drink driving is infinitely worse than what Tomkins did, I didn’t see Matthew Right hosting a debate on whether he should be allowed on TV again. He admitted a problem, and will be a national treasure again this time next year.

People make mistakes, people get punished that’s the cycle, Tomkins isn’t a role model, he’s a rugby player (or not if you look at some people’s opinions) my son loves the rugby, but we’ve explained to him what Joel did and why it was bad, that’s my job as a parent, my son gets his moral standards from me, not the 13 players on a rugby field, he idolises them as young fans do, but it’s served a positive, my son is now anti-alcohol as he can see the effects it has on people, he’s only 11 so that may change, but that’s what need to monitor as a parent.

As someone else mentioned, this can very quickly become another Terry Newton, player ostracised for making a mistake, loses his lively hood and can’t support his family, we know how that ended.

This is a convenient way for some fans to try and get a player who is underperforming at the moment out so we can bring someone new in.

Great post & well said ????????????????

[morley pie eater]

No.

I think the whole debate is too focused on Joel. For me the club is in the dock. Why haven't they explained the 5 weeks, and a ban only when the video appeared?

Saying they hadn't seen the video doesn't wash. They knew about the incident and should have investigated, talked to all concerned and it would have been clear that a ban was the minimum response.

The only conclusion I can draw is that they were in danage-limitation mode, only concerned with protecting the players and the club's reputation. They (Rads/IL) deserve all the flak, more so than Joel.