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THE 18th Man wrote:

ddtftf wrote:18th MAN YOU NEED TO SEE A DOCTOR SOON

Firstly CB Warrior he may of left balls to bounce because everytime he caught them first time he got a sarcastic cheer which if it was me struggling and trying to play rugby i would have thrown my shirt at the fans because he was being singled out in a pathetic performance (i am not saying fans should not say what they feel but were was the sarcastic cheers when the team completed a set of six) secondly ddtftf i am not a Mathers fan i just think people are puting more blame on Mathers when there were players who made just as many misstakes. and lastly if we want to go into the past then Mathers is only 3rd choice full back behind Sean Brisco who we sold and Chris Ashton (money talks) and Noble wont change the wing because Amos needs time and pat and George have built a good partnership which made them the best two players last year

You have that the wrong way round. The jeers only came towards the end, simply because he'd made a cock-up of so many high balls before then.

Unfortunately, I agree with you that Nobby will probably bring him back in after his ban.

The problem with this thread is that it singles out a single player when it was a team failure, and it starts with a single negative assumption that "X" must go.
It's much harder to come up with answers to problems than just to dish out blame. Let's try to keep this thread and forum above the level of the Daily Mail (not too difficult I'll grant you) and be constructive.
KiwiSeddon has pointed out the stats, and for all the issues, Radlinski is an impossible act to follow.
Yes we do want and deserve better from our current full back. But how much of that is because of the direction of the team and how much because of poor ball distribution?
All too often over the last few seasons we have seen wooden and unimaginative games which better teams have demolished.
I maintain that we really do have good players, and for all the flak flying, I believe we do have a good coach. What I am less sure about is whether we have on the field leadership and direction that is consistent and imaginative. And the result of that is that when things go wrong we can't right them.
No, the Wigan fans shouldn't cheer ironically, but we have kind of got used to mediocre performances from the club that once ruled the Rugby League world. We crave better, but it's not just one player that's at fault.

well....

Some things in life are bad
they can really make you mad
other things just make you swear and curse
when your chewing life's gristle
dont grumble
give a whistle
and this'll help thing turn out for the best
and..

always look on the bright side of life

this must have been made for Wigan

MATHERS WAS FAR AND AWAY THE WORST PLAYER ON THE PITCH!
I too was preaching the "New season, new chance" gospel regarding Mathers. Boy do I feel foolish now?
He never even attempted to go for the high bombs, he seems to be afraid that the ball might smash his pretty boy looks or something.
For a fullback to not try to catch a ball is dereliction of duty, his job is to catch the ball!! he may be being singled out, but that is because in a team of terrible players on Sunday, he sank to a new low.
I hope hets a 4 match ban, then Noble won't be able to select him.
Every team in Superleague will target him now with bomb's, Why? BECAUSE THEY ALL KNOW HE IS USELESS!!

There were a lot of bad performances by the Wigan players against Wakefield which is why Wigan lost. You can't single at Mathers as the reason why Wigan lost but no one deny that he made some obvious mistakes against Wakefield.

The thing is Mathers has been making these sort of mistakes for the last season. If you can not catch or tackle you should not be a full back, probably should not be playing rugby league at all.

Mathers was recovering from an injury last season which could explain his "rusty" performances. He has had a full season/off season now and the start of the new season gave him a chance to start again. Any excuses there are for his poor performances must be running low now so he hasn't to start playing well for the sake of Wigan this season.

Has Mathers ever had a good game for Wigan??

stevethegas wrote: I maintain that we really do have good players, and for all the flak flying, I believe we do have a good coach. What I am less sure about is whether we have on the field leadership and direction that is consistent and imaginative.

I have never thought Lockers was the right man for the captaincy but I don't think you can blame that or lack of on-field leadership from other players for the way the team has played last season at times and on Sunday.

There are just no decent tactics. None. So for me we either have a good coach and a team that can't execute his plays (but then the majority of these players have had contracts agreed under Noble). Or we have a good set of players and a poor coach devoid of modern tactical ideas.

Given we have seen the likes of Hock and Lockers play well for GB, TL do so at 9 for the kiwis and have players who have had successful stints in the NRL I am drawn to the inevitable conclusion the coach is at fault.

I suppose the third possibility is both team and coach are sub standard.

I do think we have some sub standard players. Coley stands out. Mathers, well I wanted him to succeed as much ans anyone and I do think he has become this season Higham already only he is even more unpopular but at the end of the day if he can't play the game what do you do?

We crave better, but it's not just one player that's at fault.

Rightly or wrongly the buck always stops with the coach.

Dave

stevethegas wrote:The problem with this thread is that it singles out a single player when it was a team failure, and it starts with a single negative assumption that "X" must go.
It's much harder to come up with answers to problems than just to dish out blame. Let's try to keep this thread and forum above the level of the Daily Mail (not too difficult I'll grant you) and be constructive.
KiwiSeddon has pointed out the stats, and for all the issues, Radlinski is an impossible act to follow.
Yes we do want and deserve better from our current full back. But how much of that is because of the direction of the team and how much because of poor ball distribution?
All too often over the last few seasons we have seen wooden and unimaginative games which better teams have demolished.
I maintain that we really do have good players, and for all the flak flying, I believe we do have a good coach. What I am less sure about is whether we have on the field leadership and direction that is consistent and imaginative. And the result of that is that when things go wrong we can't right them.
No, the Wigan fans shouldn't cheer ironically, but we have kind of got used to mediocre performances from the club that once ruled the Rugby League world. We crave better, but it's not just one player that's at fault.

But you can't change the whole team, yet surely it's obvious that some changes have to be made. What people are saying is that the worst performers should be dropped, and Mathers was clearly the worst, so should be the first to go. It would be harsh to drop anyone else and yet let him keep his place.

Mathers had a shocker and not for thr first time.It is quite obvious that his confidence is completely shattered and he is scared of making more mistakes so the barracking and jeering is only making matters worse.Supporters should get off his back and give him some encouragement. I am not saying this because i am a fan of his,quite the opposite as i always thought him defensively poor but ok as an attacking full back. However the fact is he is here for a while and he is going to be playing for us then we need him to gain his confidence back asap.

Unfortunately, Richie Mathers has never been a very good player. He had 1 (A single season) of moderate success in a very strong Leeds team when he scored 14 tries. Apart from that he has hardly troubled the try charts before or after.

If he did at least one part of the RL game adequately he would have a chance. Chris Ashton was no great shakes defensively but he was excellent in attack.

Somewhere, somehow IL and Noble decided not only to sign Mathers but also to reward him and extend his contract. Why? He was treated favourably, too favourably by Wigan RLFC in 2007/2008 and he failed regularly to produce. He has again been given ample opportunity and failed.

Brian Noble uses a phrase duty of care well I am sorry but in terms of Richie Mathers he has not exercised duty of care. He needed to be withdrawn from first team action and played either in the reserves or loaned to a NL club to give him some prospect of gaining confidence and trying to be a SL player.

When people cry about Mathers, spare a thought for Goulding who must think what do I have to do to get a game and why am I so readily dropped when players keep their place despite making mistakes.

Wendell Sailor about Wayne Bennett and pre season training with St George Dragons

"We had a training session at 6.30am after a couple of days off.

"We just came back and he said, 'guys, you know what I want, if you're not going to aim up, you're not going to be in the team'."

I'd agree with most of the comments about individual player performances, but also think it's more important not to single out one player from a 17 man performance. As for jeering one of our players on the pitch, regardless of their performace, it is lamentable.

The single most obvious problem on Sunday was the wholesale lack of team commitment to each other and playing cohesion. At one point Fielden and O'loughlin were arguing with each other on the field about who's fault a particular knock-on was. Immediately before this incident in preceding set of six, Wakefield had knocked on, their player put his hand up and received pats on the back from his mates. That says it all. The players in our team are obviously talented individuals but that's what they play like.

Whatever the 'team' problems where last year I'd guess they've resurfaced.