Re: released players

- psycho - · Post by **- psycho -** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:41 pm

wrong fraggle. he didnt perform at center and he didnt perform at loose forward but he has done a decent job at fullback when betts was coaching us. he hasn't had much of a chance at stand off. he played well in the salford game away and has in a number of games this season. center and loose forward are not his "preffered position". he is by profession a stand off and hasn't been given a big chance to play stand off this season. he has scored 9 tries this season only 3 behind brett dallas who is our leading scorer and if you don't trust that little piece of information then go to the official site. in my opinion i would make kevin brown the stand off for the rest of the season. i prefer him to danny orr who i think was a waste seeing performances at stadiums such as huddersfield were he was a disgrace to watch. hmmm brown has produced the goods for us though this year. the amount of points scored portrays this. was you all saying the same when connolly was dropping balls at full back when he was young. look how he turned out. GIVE THE MAN A CHANCE!!!

Fraggle · Post by **Fraggle** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:59 pm

- psycho - posted:
wrong fraggle. he didnt perform at center and he didnt perform at loose forward but he has done a decent job at fullback when betts was coaching us.

No-one was doing a good job when Betts was coaching us! That's part of the reason so many people wanted him out. But I'll grant you that he wasn't a disaster at FB unlike some others.

center and loose forward are not his "preffered position".

I think I also said that centre, LF and FB were not his preferred positions, but centre is the position at he has played most of his SL games rather than at stand-off.

he is by profession a stand off and hasn't been given a big chance to play stand off this season... in my opinion i would make kevin brown the stand off for the rest of the season. i prefer him to danny orr who i think was a waste seeing performances at stadiums such as huddersfield were he was a disgrace to watch.

Ok, so you've got a player that's an experienced SL stand-off who's had some awful games but also been creating some chances and defending quite well and now he's able to play more than 2 games in a row is starting to work with his halfback partner, and a player who's been all over the park but rarely at stand-off, has not done anything when he has played at stand-off (you've almost said yourself he's been better in other positions than the rare occasions he's played at s-o) yet you want to replace the experienced player with Brown? Orr may have been cr@p in a couple of games, but Brown has also been cr@p in a couple of games so I can't really see any reason to put him above the more experienced player.

hmmm brown has produced the goods for us though this year. the amount of points scored portrays this. was you all saying the same when connolly was dropping balls at full back when he was young. look how he turned out. GIVE THE MAN A CHANCE!!!

He's had 21 chances this year! He's not really been much more impressive than Aspinwall and Wild who everyone wants to get rid of, and they're not much older than he is. They've also been scoring tries this year but everyone seems to have run out of patience with them. I would love to see Brown secure a regular spot, but frequent passes to row C, not passing to support players and his other faults are not the way to do it. Would it really be so bad for him to drop back to the U21's for a couple of games to try and find some form if it will help him come back a better player?

- psycho - · Post by **- psycho -** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:11 pm

i agree he is inconsistant and yes he hasn't really ound much form but danny orr being the experienced player should be setting an example. isn't doing though is he. what a chance for brown to gain experience at stand off and mature in his actual position and to say hes done know better than aspers and wild..... obviously as he made the GB squad didn't he. or was i just imagening that. can we please stop the argument and get back to the original post of released players. the reason this argument started was because someone said he was crap. now that i disagree with. don't know about you.

Fraggle · Post by **Fraggle** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:24 pm

- psycho - posted:
can we please stop the argument and get back to the original post of released players. the reason this argument started was because someone said he was crap. now that i disagree with. don't know about you.

Arguments, or "discussions" as we like to call them!, are what this place is all about. We can't all agree, and sometimes it's not possible to convince other people that your view is right. Doesn't matter, your opinion is yours and no-one's got the right to take that away from you. But you'll soon find out that these topics don't tend to wander off the original subject a lot of the time, it's a natural thing and we don't take any action unless things get totally off the point.

As for this particular discussion, had the club released Brown instead of him signing a new contract then he could have been added to the list of released players that, it could be argued, have been a mistake. Lots of people had been calling for Brown to go, would that have been a mistake? Your opinion is yes, and I respect that (and I probably agree he deserves a bit longer before a final decision is made, unless we can get an Aussie test player in his place).

In terms of the names originally mentioned, I'm not convinced that letting Robinson go was a mistake, he's doing well at Salford but we're better at Salford and he was never totally convincing at Wigan. Like Phil Jones, he had some superb games, but he had others which suggested he wasn't the finished article and not ready to guide Wigan to success on a regular basis. Briscoe was the right player at the wrong time, and had we had any player apart from Rads at fullback then he would probably have had his chance. I'd love to see him back at Wigan once Rads has retired, he'll have matured by then and having had regular SL exposure should be able to do an excellent job for us. Connolly had lost his pace when he rejoined us from Leeds, and, whilst he'd been a great, wasn't up to being in a top 4 team anymore. He would have been expensive to retain, and with Aspinwall, Wild, Vaealiki, Brown and others all potentially vying for the centre spot he would have struggled to get a game regularly enough to justify his beer fund.

But all of these judgements are made with the benefit of hindsight, and the management at Wigan have a very difficult task to know for sure who is going to be a success, who is going to get injured, who is going to reach a point where they've developed as far as they can go, and who deserves a first-team place but other players are standing in their way so for the player's benefit they maybe need to go elsewhere to get regular first team football.

mike binder · Post by **mike binder** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:58 pm

thought to play stand off you had to be a good ball passer ,sorry but kb isnt to selfish :eh:

GeoffN · Post by **GeoffN** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 7:06 pm

I'm kinda reserving judgement on KB, but if Millward thinks he's worth another years, i'm quite happy to respect his opinion!

from the clubsite...
"Kevin is still only 20 and a very exciting player. He is still improving and as he gets better, which I am sure he will, he will be an important part of our attack."

mike binder · Post by **mike binder** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 7:12 pm

GeoffN posted:
I'm kinda reserving judgement on KB, but if Millward thinks he's worth another years, i'm quite happy to respect his opinion!

from the clubsite...
"Kevin is still only 20 and a very exciting player. He is still improving and as he gets better, which I am sure he will, he will be an important part of our attack."

dont you think he needs to learn to pass the ball more instead of trying to take the defence on all th time :eh:

GeoffN · Post by **GeoffN** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 7:44 pm

mike binder posted:
GeoffN posted:
I'm kinda reserving judgement on KB, but if Millward thinks he's worth another years, i'm quite happy to respect his opinion!

from the clubsite...
"Kevin is still only 20 and a very exciting player. He is still improving and as he gets better, which I am sure he will, he will be an important part of our attack."
dont you think he needs to learn to pass the ball more instead of trying to take the defence on all th time :eh:

I think he needs to learn when to do it and when not to, but Orr gets criticised for not taking on the line often enough! A stand-off needs both options available, but only a great one gets it right every time, and we haven't had one of those since Edwards.

GeoffN · Post by **GeoffN** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 9:14 pm

The_Bad_Guy posted:
i think brown will be a good stand-off, however i don't think that replacing danny orr with him is the way to go, i think we should just wait, keep him in the squad, like on the bench or somethin, and then play him when the chance arrives, you never know he might make a better scrum-half, just like a certain shaun edwards from some years back

Yep. He's only going to get a bench spot until all the injuries set in again! Shaun started at full back, remember.

GeoffN · Post by **GeoffN** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 9:29 pm

The_Bad_Guy posted:

a bit before my time that Geoff i vaguely remember him at stand off but nothin before that but i was only young then

when Shaun started, we had a certain Brett Kenny in the side at standoff! (although Shaun was in the '84 Wembley side, IIRC, when we lost to Widnes...I think at the time he was the youngest Cup Final player). He moved to stand off when Gregory came, then to scrum half when Greg left, and Botica went to #6...that would have been '93, I think.