Danny Orr told he can leave

[stevocod]

mrs_carney posted:
You cant knock him until we've tried him. Both him and richards kicked for their previous clubs. You cant just say yeah get rid of him because he's not a goalkicker, he's far more useful than that because he creates the tries! Face it we arent going to get another goalkicker with a percentage as high as Dobsons or even Faz before it. Orr cant be forced to leave and IMO he should stay and show Lulu what it takes to get into the team, and for your information Lulu was a kicker before he went to London, i open the gates for you to rant about how he's not good enough to kick for us either.

Firstly i don't want Danny Orr to move but i am just thinking how Nobby may see it, if we buy more props, Lulu and Barrett at halfs and perhaps another winger, if we are filling up cap spots, unfortunately i could forsee Orr going. Orr was never a top kicker for Cas and as Geoff mentioned Richards not a highly successful one either.

Why can't we get someone with a percentage rate the same as Dobbo or Faz? Someone signing out of the blue like Deacs or someone (without re-surfacing too many rumours!).

Lulu maybe an ok kicker, but is he confirmed as a Wigan player yet? I am sure Nobby has this covered for next year.

[GeoffN]

stevocod posted:

mrs_carney posted:
You cant knock him until we've tried him. Both him and richards kicked for their previous clubs. You cant just say yeah get rid of him because he's not a goalkicker, he's far more useful than that because he creates the tries! Face it we arent going to get another goalkicker with a percentage as high as Dobsons or even Faz before it. Orr cant be forced to leave and IMO he should stay and show Lulu what it takes to get into the team, and for your information Lulu was a kicker before he went to London, i open the gates for you to rant about how he's not good enough to kick for us either.

Firstly i don't want Danny Orr to move but i am just thinking how Nobby may see it, if we buy more props, Lulu and Barrett at halfs and perhaps another winger, if we are filling up cap spots, unfortunately i could forsee Orr going. Orr was never a top kicker for Cas and as Geoff mentioned Richards not a highly successful one either.

Why can't we get someone with a percentage rate the same as Dobbo or Faz? Someone signing out of the blue like Deacs or someone (without re-surfacing too many rumours!).

Lulu maybe an ok kicker, but is he confirmed as a Wigan player yet? I am sure Nobby has this covered for next year.

I don't like going along the route of selecting someone just on the basis of their goalkicking ability, though, which IMO is all Deacon offers. All the top kickers we've had have been good players too (even Tickle, up until this season).

[stevocod]

GeoffN posted:

stevocod posted:

mrs_carney posted:
You cant knock him until we've tried him. Both him and richards kicked for their previous clubs. You cant just say yeah get rid of him because he's not a goalkicker, he's far more useful than that because he creates the tries! Face it we arent going to get another goalkicker with a percentage as high as Dobsons or even Faz before it. Orr cant be forced to leave and IMO he should stay and show Lulu what it takes to get into the team, and for your information Lulu was a kicker before he went to London, i open the gates for you to rant about how he's not good enough to kick for us either.

Firstly i don't want Danny Orr to move but i am just thinking how Nobby may see it, if we buy more props, Lulu and Barrett at halfs and perhaps another winger, if we are filling up cap spots, unfortunately i could forsee Orr going. Orr was never a top kicker for Cas and as Geoff mentioned Richards not a highly successful one either.

Why can't we get someone with a percentage rate the same as Dobbo or Faz? Someone signing out of the blue like Deacs or someone (without re-surfacing too many rumours!).

Lulu maybe an ok kicker, but is he confirmed as a Wigan player yet? I am sure Nobby has this covered for next year.

I don't like going along the route of selecting someone just on the basis of their goalkicking ability, though, which IMO is all Deacon offers. All the top kickers we've had have been good players too (even Tickle, up until this season).

But these players mentioned are back up players at least and would have at least liked the club to try and retain the services of Dobbo. But he has gone and i'm sorry in the close games i would rather tries converted than not and Richards and Orr are not reliable enough and look at the top four clubs in SL with all reliable kickers and with that added influx when Dobbo came in we were beating top clubs in Leeds and Bradford and i'm sure it would be more effective with a top kicker than not.

How many close games did Dobbo or Faz win with the kicks being the most important aspect to it?

[mrs_carney]

But you cant select someone in the side because they are a good kicker, just purely on that basis, when they could provide nothing else for the team. Deacon is a goalkicker, hes not a creative scrum half, Dobbo was both. Faz was an immense player as well as a kicker. Tickle was an outstanding player last year and a good kicker. You need to create tries to convert them in the first place.

[DaveO]

stevocod posted:
Firstly i don't want Danny Orr to move but i am just thinking how Nobby may see it, if we buy more props, Lulu and Barrett at halfs and perhaps another winger, if we are filling up cap spots, unfortunately i could forsee Orr going.

I have seen this said before and its warped logic to my mind.

For a start there is no way any club should consider gettiing rid of players who are doing well who want to play for the club (as Orr is and does). There is no guarentee Lulu would have the committment to Wigam Orr does.

If we get Lulu and get rid of Orr I don't see how this will free up any money for props or other players. Orr is rumoured to have come to Wigan for less money than he could have got elsewhere and I don't think Lulu would be coming fr £25K a season either.

Replacing Orr with Lulu is replacing one half back with another, won't IMO free up any cash and so just what is the point?

I can't see Noble wanting this as he strikes me as too pragmatic. He has seen what Orr can do so the half backs ought to be Barrett and Orr - boxes ticked.

Now if Lulu came as well as those two to offer competition for places then great but otherwise his coming solves nothing.

What I also don't understand is the seemingly could not care less attitude of the club as to if Orr stays or goes. Why are they saying one of the form players of the second half of the season can speak to other clubs? I just don't understand it and this looks like Mo having done a deal with Lulu and being forced to free up cap space rather than down to any foresight or planning.

Dave

[stevocod]

DaveO posted:

stevocod posted:
Firstly i don't want Danny Orr to move but i am just thinking how Nobby may see it, if we buy more props, Lulu and Barrett at halfs and perhaps another winger, if we are filling up cap spots, unfortunately i could forsee Orr going.

I have seen this said before and its warped logic to my mind.

For a start there is no way any club should consider gettiing rid of players who are doing well who want to play for the club (as Orr is and does). There is no guarentee Lulu would have the committment to Wigam Orr does.

If we get Lulu and get rid of Orr I don't see how this will free up any money for props or other players. Orr is rumoured to have come to Wigan for less money than he could have got elsewhere and I don't think Lulu would be coming fr £25K a season either.

Replacing Orr with Lulu is replacing one half back with another, won't IMO free up any cash and so just what is the point?

I can't see Noble wanting this as he strikes me as too pragmatic. He has seen what Orr can do so the half backs ought to be Barrett and Orr - boxes ticked.

Now if Lulu came as well as those two to offer competition for places then great but otherwise his coming solves nothing.

What I also don't understand is the seemingly could not care less attitude of the club as to if Orr stays or goes. Why are they saying one of the form players of the second half of the season can speak to other clubs? I just don't understand it and this looks like Mo having done a deal with Lulu and being forced to free up cap space rather than down to any foresight or planning.

Dave

Well this being said, why didn't we retain Dobson and keep as Mrs C said someone who can goalkick and a quality creative half and then allow Barrett and Orr to fight out for the jersey or use Orr in the Dunemann role where he can switch to hooker if necessary and someone useful to bring on after Higham has run them ragged from dummy half.

Orr is a very loyal player yes and i would like him to stay but will the club see it that way? If he does go it will be a shame. I would however like to see at least one prop bought to cover Feka as we know Fielden can do 80 no problem.

[stevocod]

mrs_carney posted:
But you cant select someone in the side because they are a good kicker, just purely on that basis, when they could provide nothing else for the team. Deacon is a goalkicker, hes not a creative scrum half, Dobbo was both. Faz was an immense player as well as a kicker. Tickle was an outstanding player last year and a good kicker. You need to create tries to convert them in the first place.

Well the halfs don't to kick ala Faz and could be Orr and Barrett as previously mentioned. Barrett is obviously being bought because he is an outstanding creative half and should be more than capable of creating tries as well as Orr if he stays, i just feel in the close games you need as many points as possible.

If we are in a close grand final ala '98, goalkicking does help and i'm sure when Dobbo came here his accurate kicking in the field of play or goal is what we need and i don't know why we didn't try and retain his services unless there was already a provision for someone else to come in before his loan spell.

I would have no problem with Deacon if he came and his grubber kicks are very dangerous and i feel he would link well with Barrett and we can use Orr around that, just an idea which would fit in IMO but Orr can be utilised in a hooking role or either half position, so why not do both?

[Martin Taylor]

stevocod posted:

DaveO posted:

stevocod posted:
Firstly i don't want Danny Orr to move but i am just thinking how Nobby may see it, if we buy more props, Lulu and Barrett at halfs and perhaps another winger, if we are filling up cap spots, unfortunately i could forsee Orr going.

I have seen this said before and its warped logic to my mind.

For a start there is no way any club should consider gettiing rid of players who are doing well who want to play for the club (as Orr is and does). There is no guarentee Lulu would have the committment to Wigam Orr does.

If we get Lulu and get rid of Orr I don't see how this will free up any money for props or other players. Orr is rumoured to have come to Wigan for less money than he could have got elsewhere and I don't think Lulu would be coming fr £25K a season either.

Replacing Orr with Lulu is replacing one half back with another, won't IMO free up any cash and so just what is the point?

I can't see Noble wanting this as he strikes me as too pragmatic. He has seen what Orr can do so the half backs ought to be Barrett and Orr - boxes ticked.

Now if Lulu came as well as those two to offer competition for places then great but otherwise his coming solves nothing.

What I also don't understand is the seemingly could not care less attitude of the club as to if Orr stays or goes. Why are they saying one of the form players of the second half of the season can speak to other clubs? I just don't understand it and this looks like Mo having done a deal with Lulu and being forced to free up cap space rather than down to any foresight or planning.

Dave

Well this being said, why didn't we retain Dobson and keep as Mrs C said someone who can goalkick and a quality creative half and then allow Barrett and Orr to fight out for the jersey or use Orr in the Dunemann role where he can switch to hooker if necessary and someone useful to bring on after Higham has run them ragged from dummy half.

Orr is a very loyal player yes and i would like him to stay but will the club see it that way? If he does go it will be a shame. I would however like to see at least one prop bought to cover Feka as we know Fielden can do 80 no problem.

We couldn't retain Dobson. He was not our player to retain. He was already contracted to Canbera!

[DaveO]

stevocod posted:
Well this being said, why didn't we retain Dobson and keep as Mrs C said someone who can goalkick and a quality creative half and then allow Barrett and Orr to fight out for the jersey or use Orr in the Dunemann role where he can switch to hooker if necessary and someone useful to bring on after Higham has run them ragged from dummy half.

There are two reasons why we didn't keep Dobson. First we had already filled out overseas quota for next season with Fletcher, Baily and Barret. These three were already contract to Wigen before Dobson arrived. Secondly as has been mentioned Dobson had a contract with Canberra so he was not ours to keep even if we had an overseas slot for him.

Orr is a very loyal player yes and i would like him to stay but will the club see it that way?

If the don't as I have argued I don't see any logic in letting him go.

If he does go it will be a shame. I would however like to see at least one prop bought to cover Feka as we know Fielden can do 80 no problem.

We definately need at least one more quality prop but swapping Orr for Lulu won't affect that one way or the other.

Dave

[cpwigan]

One point about Lu Lu. I may be wrong but he has not managed to play a full season anywhere yet without being injured.