Page 7 of 17
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:34 pm
by ancientnloyal
I said a few days ago if we were showing Widnes any respect with that lineup - WE DIDN'T! What a tragic error to change the team too much. We have the Challenge Cup around the corner have this changed squad then not now!
I saw this coming and we've ended up with egg on our faces. It's ok changing 1 or 2 players but why rest some key players 6 games into the season? Well done Betts and Widnes. We should have improved our for/against and got top spot and kicked on to be the team to beat but no.
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:39 pm
by Bashy
Hanley the God! wrote:
Now means SW has to field a full strength side against Broncos to avoid further embarrassment and to re-buile momentum ahead of the Wire game.
nahhhh hot off the press is that he is fielding the entire U20's team against bronco's?
were not even mid way through the season, not even a third in so why do the players need a rest? why did we have to start with 4 kids on the team and then within 15 minutes we had another 3 senior players substituted for kids too? thats when Widnes came back and scored their first 18.
7 days ago we ended Catalans 100% unbeaten run, today we end Widnes' 100% BEATEN run, there is simply no excuse for it!
we needed to Blood new players, we needed to rest some of the seniors..... ok so how about this? start off with a full strength team, hammer Widnes to within an inch of their life for 40 minutes then when the game is won swap a few of the seniors out for the kids on the bench? if thats not to your fancy rest 2 this week and 2 next week?!
Getting beaten is one thing but SW being cockey enough to drop half the first team and then be beaten by bottom of the league Widnes when really that should have been a walk in the park for us... that my friends is just an insult!
defence was full of holes, attack was full of handling errors. Josh proved he can kick thats for sure, a 40m penalty was a big ask and sadly one he couldnt manage but even that should have been run in rather than taken for 2.
now who do i need to see for my refund? 3 of us went to widnes today expecting to see us put 100 on them and go top, what we actually got was insulted!
it was only last weekend i was having a crack with the missus (saints fan) about them messing up in dropping Foster and then loosing out on the game because of a missed conversion in the closing stages.... yes its fair to say im getting a sizeable amount of grief for today now!
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:41 pm
by kevoakes
I usually just read everything that everyone else posts on hear, but after paying to go and watch that today, i have had to register myself an account.
People are saying arrogance or ignorance, defo arrogance.
I listened to SW slating Maguires defensive attitude over the last two seasons and how he was holding himself back watching games as he wanted to atack attack attack.
I was thinking arrogant sod but was prepared to watch what he came up with and he did come up trumps, all be it after round 1.
Today was just arrogance to the max.
How can you leave Sam, Lockers, Tommy and Pat out of the team, all at the same time too. The main lynch pins of the team as well.
As others have said, they are all for giving youth a go but today SW hit the self destruct button.
Widnes had current and ex players in their tema today and will have wanted to prove a point.
Stef Marsh showed that as well today by ripping Jack Hughes to bits.
All in all, we were poor but should have won the game.
Can't make any excuses but the ref and his assistance had a shocker.
I was directly behind the sticks when they scored the winning try, blaitent knock on.
SW, you have a lot to learn.
I now feel better for that.
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:19 pm
by DaveO
cherry.pie wrote:DaveO wrote:Cherry, you are talking utter b@llocks.
Wane will have learned nothing from today and neither will the players. How do you learn anything about players when the team has never played together before and is so much weaker in key positions? So many changes mean you have no idea why things went they way they did there are just too many variables.
If you take out five senior pros and replace them with youngsters you end up with a team isn't a team that does not know each other and one very likely to blow an 18 point lead. How on earth can you learn about players strengths and weaknesses when they are playing in a side so disrupted?
And saying certain players would not have been shown up if we had a stronger side out is just nuts. It's team game and if the sum of its parts is stronger than the individuals then that is the whole point.
The ides introducing players gradually is too easy is a complete joke. It is hard for any young player to step up to SL level even if they are the only new player in the side. There are only 13 men on the pitch each with a job to do and anyone making their début has their work cut out as it is.
What we had today was a situation where instead of young players playing alongside the likes of Tommy and Lockers and learning from them they had to replace them. Utterly stupid.
That has never been the way to do it and it suddenly didn't get to be the right way because a Wigan coach did it.
As someone else pointed out and I mentioned before next week is a must win game because if Leeds and Cats win games in hand we drop down to 5th I think. So instead of one or two youngsters in this week and one or two next in the side it will have been wholesale changes this week and back to the first team next. Pointless. Especially thet noen of our first team players should need a rest a mere five games in.
Wane will have learned plenty as will the players. Most of those players have played in the side before during the friendly games so it's not like they were complete strangers.
And I wouldn't take much notice of the table either. If Wigan are good enough to reach the Grand Final we'll finish at least in the top 4 regardless of this performance.
The youngsters weren't to blame for blowing the 18 point lead. The 18 point lead was blown because senior players were making some very basic mistakes and giving Widnes penalty after penalty after penalty.
The bottom line is had we won this game comfortably as the team was quite capable of doing most people would have no criticism of Wane whatsoever. Senior players let the team down in terms of discipline but the youngsters gave their all.
You are still talking b@ollocks.
He will have learned nothing. Zilch.
All he will have "learned" is if you put out an under strength side with so many kids in it you will get beaten by the even the bottom club.
Now given he would never play that team against a strong side he now has no idea how any of those young players would fit into the first team structure alongside the senior pros. A completely pointless exercise.
He is experienced enough to know a team like that would not only be unfamiliar with each other but also much weaker so what did he expect?
We will have to see what he does next week. Will he be arrogant enough to repeat a similar selection in an attempt to prove he was right or will he basically admit he was wrong by picking the first team?
The bottom line is we lost because of Wanes selection and if he wants to keep his job I reckon he had better not make a habit of it.
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:40 pm
by Fujiman
Its at times like this that i miss the input of CPW :conf:
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:41 pm
by TrueBlueWarrior
We can all talk about it till we are blue in the face! The bottom line is, we lost to a Widnes team that is nothing short of awful in terms of a SL side! I said on a previous post that we probably could afford to make 2-3 changes at maximum, not 6-7 with pivotal players missing, especially SOL! Yes it is great to give youth a chance but don't we do that already? Haven't we got enough players in the first team squad that have come through the ranks at the right time? Not in a game, all at once that we needed to win to maintain momentum, to give us the option of 2-3 changes at maximum against Broncos, ready for Wire the game after? Sorry but yeah it is great to rest players but it is certainly not great to lose against an awful team when we could go top of the league and for me winning is paramount, I never want to lose, it is not acceptable, infact it is embarrassing!
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:48 pm
by DaveO
cherry.pie wrote:
Dave, the bottom line is we lost because the players on the pitch didn't play to the standards they are capable of, and I'm not talking about the débutantes who did quite well. We lost because of indiscipline which piggy backed Widnes up the field for almost every single one of their tries.
We know how well every single one of those players that played today can defend, and they can all defend much better than they did.
It's quite obvious what areas of their game each of those young players needs to work on.
And why do you think they were making mistakes and leaked 37 points given we had the best defence in the league up until today? Inexperience and not being a team who know each other is why and that is down to Wane picking that particular team.
The idea it was the players fault and Wane's selection had no part in this is ludicrous.
You know as well as I do had Wane picked a more normal side with just a couple of kids in it we would have won this game. Experienced players like Sam and Lockers would not have seen us leak away an 18 point lead against a side like Widnes. That is just obviously the case.
You do not go from ending the unbeaten run of a side like Les Cats to losing to a side like Widnes unless something is drastically different and it was. The Wigan team that took to the field!
Before the season started Wane said he wanted to cut out the stupid losses he felt we ended up with last season. Games he felt we should have won. Well this is right up there with those and he is the main reason why it is.
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:58 pm
by ancientnloyal
Fujiman wrote:Its at times like this that i miss the input of CPW :conf:
:inlo:
20,001
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 9:06 pm
by DaveO
exile in Tiger country wrote:Really? We got more from this apart from two vital league points, the chance to go top of the league and increase our points difference? What exactly did we get, apart from embarrassed and a reputation for not showing any respect to opposition sides.
Wane should be hauled over the coals for this team selection!
Spot on. Wanes after match comments about him picking a team that was 100% capable of winning this match are clearly wrong given the players capable of winning it were the ones sat in the stand.
Apparently he is gutted again that we lost. Well Shaun that is your own fault!
Re: Widnes v Wigan
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 9:33 pm
by cpwigan
Right, breaking my rules here but this is 20,002
HOWEVER,
Players do need blooding BUT no coach is being fair to any youngsters blooding so many players collectively against a team fielding several Wiganers / ex Wigan players with the added motivation that brings.
Jack Hughes is learning first grade / playing centre. He needs Pat alongside him. Add say 1 player, Joe Mellor or Matty Russell. You really cannot afford any more especially when you remove the heart / spine of the team. Moreover, the very sould of this team, our captain, Lockers. If needs must you can scrape by with inexperienced players on the fringes alongside the leader (the best all round player in SL) / 'leaders' BUT to send our young guns into battle without leadership smacked of General Haigh not Super Shaun Wane.
Waney IMO is showing traits as to why top NRL coaches are always better than British coaches. He is too pre - occupied with high risk razzle dazzle attacking RL which will never in the long run beat the clinical professionalism of NRL coached RL.
Today was a mistake, a mistake on his (Waney's) part. The team changed several times before kick off during the week etc. Several changes were cosmetic. Waney treated the youngsters in his charge unfairly IMO. Those young lads deserved to play with Lockers, with Pat etc. Wigan RLFC are similarly to blame for continually allowing our loanees to play against us. Arrogant!
2 losses down to arrogance.
Is the Wigan Way arrogance?
P.S He is rarely right
but on this occasion IMO Dave O is correct.
