joe burgess

[shaunedwardsfanclub]

As far as I am concerned, Burgess like Chris Ashton has set his stall out from the beginning to make a impression and go elsewhere for more money.

He may have been outstanding in his first season, but over the seasons, there have been many players who have done the same but then faded.

I also think that at the age of twenty and with his limited experience at top level, he is too young for the harder NRL and will find it tougher than he expects.

It's not all about sunning on Bondi Beach!

Is the fact that he is going next season fair on Manfredi who in my opinion is the player to replace him, especially as he is a better tackler than Burgess.

Burgess or Manfredi, who should it be on the left wing?

**Burgess in my view, he is a natural winger. Dom could yet become a centre although at present he is the ideal replacement for Budgie. Obviously he is going to find it harder in the NRL as he will be playing against better opposition, but I am willing to bet that he will become a regular England international under Madge.

** Fixed your post, your reply was inside the quote & in the middle of WW's post ???????? Josie

[medlocke]

Bring in Manfredi now and loan Burgess out to Leigh for the season, enough said, he obviously never wanted to have a career at Wigan and just used the club to get a super duper NRL contract, NO player is greater than the club

[OJ]

What surprises me is that on my other post about Ryan Shutton signing a 4yr contract their are only a couple replies saying well done to the club for getting him to resign. Yet on here their are over 50 replies and quite a few slagging the club and Burgess off for them not keeping him or for him not staying. We seem quick to criticize and slow to praise at times.

Fair comment but think it would be more worrying had there been no comments about a good player leaving us. Personally I'm always pleased when any of the squad who are ok sign long term deals but don't get excited about it any more either as in many cases all it seems to mean is that the club can get more money for them when they go as was the case with Sam

[i'm spartacus]

I don't give a monkey's nut his reasons or the crap that comes from the clubs pr machine. It's like me putting thousands of pound into my car and then selling it for peanuts. What about loyalty by JB. He comes on the scene for a season and a half scores some cracking tries and then thinks he and the Nrl think he'super star.Wigan do the pooch thing and roll over allowing the likes of Crowe to kick them in the nuts instead of giving them a big bone as a reward.It's about time Wigan made these young players honour the contract they signed upto to get them noticed in the first place. I really don't give a toss about the flack I will get from others on this forum.It's my right to say what I think and I think show some bloody Loyalty to the club and the supporters for a change.And stop giving us the usual rubbish answers etc etc etc.Whats the point of a contract if people are not going to honour it. Right then. Let the insults fly.

I think you read too much into what the contract is to be honest.

If you sign AN Other on a three year contract you are securing his services for three years, but it is a contract not a prison sentence. Freedom to choose our own destiny is an inalienable human right. There may be consequences for not doing something we promised/contracted to do, but nothing on earth could stop us from choosing not to do it. If they RFL put rules in place in an attempt to restrict anyone from choosing who they wanted to work for, it wouldn't survive the first trip to court.

Everyone has the right to want to better themselves and AN Other could have a better offer from another club, and because he has freedom of choice, he may choose to leave. Of course he is in a contract with us, and by choosing to leave he will breach that contract.

If AN Other breaches his contract, we can sue him for the breach, and the aim of any Court would be to put us in a position we would have been had he not breached the contract. You could ask the Court to make AN Other honour his contract, but the problem is that he doesn't want to be here, so no Court is going to force someone to honour an employment contract when they don't want to. Even if they could make someone do something, there would be no guarantee that they will do it well. The only real way you can get anything for the breach is through an award of monetary compensation.

This is what 'buying' players from other clubs is about. You offer the player better terms than he is currently on, and you compensate the club you are buying him from for the loss of the services he is contracted to perform. A contracted player is worth something to the club, and if they are lured away, they are a source of money you can reinvest into replacements.

On the face of it, it looks like Budgie is out of contract and going as a free agent, ergo, Wigan get nowt. I don't blame Budgie one bit for wanting to test himself in a far better competition and good luck to the lad.

[shaunedwardsfanclub]

As far as I am concerned, Burgess like Chris Ashton has set his stall out from the beginning to make a impression and go elsewhere for more money.

He may have been outstanding in his first season, but over the seasons, there have been many players who have done the same but then faded.

I also think that at the age of twenty and with his limited experience at top level, he is too young for the harder NRL and will find it tougher than he expects.

It's not all about sunning on Bondi Beach!

Is the fact that he is going next season fair on Manfredi who in my opinion is the player to replace him, especially as he is a better tackler than Burgess.

Burgess or Manfredi, who should it be on the left wing?

**Burgess in my view, he is a natural winger. Dom could yet become a centre although at present he is the ideal replacement for Budgie. Obviously he is going to find it harder in the NRL as he will be playing against better opposition, but I am willing to bet that he will become a regular England international under Madge.

** Fixed your post, your reply was inside the quote & in the middle of WW's post ???????? Josie

Thanks Josie. By the way I meant Robinson not Madge!

[KOOCH]

I don't give a monkey's nut his reasons or the crap that comes from the clubs pr machine. It's like me putting thousands of pound into my car and then selling it for peanuts. What about loyalty by JB. He comes on the scene for a season and a half scores some cracking tries and then thinks he and the Nrl think he'super star.Wigan do the pooch thing and roll over allowing the likes of Crowe to kick them in the nuts instead of giving them a big bone as a reward.It's about time Wigan made these young players honour the contract they signed upto to get them noticed in the first place. I really don't give a toss about the flack I will get from others on this forum.It's my right to say what I think and I think show some bloody Loyalty to the club and the supporters for a change.And stop giving us the usual rubbish answers etc etc etc.Whats the point of a contract if people are not going to honour it. Right then. Let the insults fly.

I think you read too much into what the contract is to be honest.

If you sign AN Other on a three year contract you are securing his services for three years, but it is a contract not a prison sentence. Freedom to choose our own destiny is an inalienable human right. There may be consequences for not doing something we promised/contracted to do, but nothing on earth could stop us from choosing not to do it. If they RFL put rules in place in an attempt to restrict anyone from choosing who they wanted to work for, it wouldn't survive the first trip to court.

Everyone has the right to want to better themselves and AN Other could have a better offer from another club, and because he has freedom of choice, he may choose to leave. Of course he is in a contract with us, and by choosing to leave he will breach that contract.

If AN Other breaches his contract, we can sue him for the breach, and the aim of any Court would be to put us in a position we would have been had he not breached the contract. You could ask the Court to make AN Other honour his contract, but the problem is that he doesn't want to be here, so no Court is going to force someone to honour an employment contract when they don't want to. Even if they could make someone do something, there would be no guarantee that they will do it well. The only real way you can get anything for the breach is through an award of monetary compensation.

This is what 'buying' players from other clubs is about. You offer the player better terms than he is currently on, and you compensate the club you are buying him from for the loss of the services he is contracted to perform. A contracted player is worth something to the club, and if they are lured away, they are a source of money you can reinvest into replacements.

On the face of it, it looks like Budgie is out of contract and going as a free agent, ergo, Wigan get nowt. I don't blame Budgie one bit for wanting to test himself in a far better competition and good luck to the lad.

Yep I do understand what a contract is and also understand that it works both ways.I voiced my opinion and it is an opinion of which I stand by.I am not really concerned what others think of my post or if they agree with me or disagree.I'm not an happy bunny. It's my opinion for what it's worth. Are we becoming a feeder club for the Nrl ? because it certainly feels like it to me. I know people will disagree with me and it is only to be expected.I know that a contract means little or nothing these days. But it still annoys me.I will give Budgie my full support whilst he's with us but once gone I could not give one hoot about him until he either returns or plays for England. Sorry if this post offends or upsets people but this is my take on the situation.

[ian.birchall]

The club started talks with Joe this time last year after he scored four tries in the Leigh friendly.

Rads said that no matter how much money they offered Joe he wanted the Sydney lifestyle.

Regardless of what the stated reasons are there has been too much PR flannel in recent seasons for them to be taken seriously.

It is however a sad state of affairs that playing for the most famous UK club and not having won a trophy with them or in fact achieved anything much in the UK game that the sport in the uK is not attractive enough to hold onto the player of his age an relative inexperience.

It really is a matter of who is next.

I read the fans via lotto raised £155,000 for youth development at Wigan. May as well have handed the cheque over to Russell Crowe.

Its all very well IL saying we couldn't keep hold of him, or Sam, or Mossop, or Russell but can anyone tell me how many stars the Whinoes have lost to Oz? Answers on a pin head please. :eusa17:

[ian.birchall]

Got a great opportunity for a successful career on a decent wage in a terrific country with a brilliant lifestyle.
Can't see for a second why he wants to do this.

It is mystery why we have any decent players left really. Instead of paying Hampshire an improved contract IL should help him find a club on Oz, pocket the agents fee and save the club the wages.

If he gets rid of all the best prospects we will soon be mediocre enough to be safe from all this and I am sure everyone will be happier in the knowledge we are so crap no one wants our players.

Australia, Sydney and its lifestyle has been there for a long time. It was a fantastic place to live 20 years ago.

In the past a few players moved down under to experience that (Malcolm Reilly being one) in pretty much the same way Pat Richards came here to do that. But not many. A few went in the off season as you could back then (as Aussies did the same the other way) but few made the move permanent.

However, it is only since the NRL got rich that this "lifestyle" thing became so attractive. Money talks and it is too easy to shrug the shoulders and say it's inevitable and IL (along with one of two other chairmen) need to do something radical to break the impasse to offering better wages than the salary cap allows. Unfortunately I am not convinced he wants to.

I'm quite convinced he has no intention to do that at all.

[No straw damn us]

The club started talks with Joe this time last year after he scored four tries in the Leigh friendly.

Rads said that no matter how much money they offered Joe he wanted the Sydney lifestyle.

Regardless of what the stated reasons are there has been too much PR flannel in recent seasons for them to be taken seriously.

It is however a sad state of affairs that playing for the most famous UK club and not having won a trophy with them or in fact achieved anything much in the UK game that the sport in the uK is not attractive enough to hold onto the player of his age an relative inexperience.

It really is a matter of who is next.

I read the fans via lotto raised £155,000 for youth development at Wigan. May as well have handed the cheque over to Russell Crowe.

Its all very well IL saying we couldn't keep hold of him, or Sam, or Mossop, or Russell but can anyone tell me how many stars the Whinoes have lost to Oz? Answers on a pin head please. :eusa17:

They lost Mathers (at the time very highly rated) they lost Baldwinson and Tonks to (NZ Warriors, Baldwinson was England academy captain) they lost Chev Walker to Union (at the time one of the best centres in RL) and they lost Calderwood to Wigan all because they stuck to their wage structure.
They've also just lost one of their and RL's best prospects Smith to Warrington.

[DaveO]

Back in the day (well 1983 in fact) Wigan paid schoolboy international Shaun Edwards, aged 17 a £35,000 signing on fee.

That would, accounting for inflation, be equivalent to £108,000 today.

Can anyone see Wigan doing that sort of thing now with Hampshire for example if clubs came sniffing?

A special talent of a tender age is spotted, with clubs queueing up to sign the player, will we be in there seriously bidding or and actually doing enough to retain the player?

I have serious doubts we will and it is no use saying we don't know how they will turn out.

We are supposed to have people and scouts who spot young talent and as a club you do what is necessary to secure it in the hope it will pay off down the line. We'd have never have signed Edwards and no doubt many other players who went on to be stars for us if the club had been so risk-averse.

Seems to me Wigan have decided to treat all players the same way wages wise regardless if any of them are clearly far better than the others. If I am right you can expect to lose every junior player of any special ability. Hampshire would be mad to stay here if Wigan won't pay what he is worth (and what he is worth won't be determined by Wigan but the market).