England v Kiwis Spoiler

[Wigan_forever1985]

My 2p worth

England are performing to a higher level than we have done in the past but dont have that spark that can change the game on a whim. The team is full of very good players the only world class player being lockers.

Tomkins is class but the problem is everyone has worked him out now, and he with bulk has lost a turn of speed that used to make him such a dangerous player.

I would say the difference between us and the kiwis today was the same as the difference between us and the aussies and that was the interchange. We weaken as soon as we take players off wereas the kiwis and aussies either stay at a level or improve.

For example Clarke goes off and we replace him with Ferres, that IMO is suicide at this level as stated he is a 2nd rower and not a centre come 2nd rower he is closer to the front row. The problem is with that not only does it weaken your own side it imrpoves the side you are facing. When clarke is at dummy half he can pass or run or take it to the line and pass, as a defender you have to cover everything and if you miss a single option he takes it. As a defender i see ferres at dummy half i think to myself, ok well he isnt going to scoot, if he does he's too slow, so already that option is gone, he isnt going to be able to take it to the line and pass before we shut him down so again dont have to cover that. So basically we have to cover his pass play, that makes your job so much easier because you can leave gaps playing the probabilities.

While this is going on tommy l is replaced by issac luke, so while you weaken thhe other team has improved. We were killing them in the first 20 and we lost 99% of our momentum after the first lot of interchanges.

I know he didnt play but Hodgson wasnt good enough, never has been and i dont think ever will be, we would of been better off taking lunt or burrow.

[medlocke]

Whaddaya mean. He was great at charging out of the line flapping his arms like a bird. I'm sure that was what Banana had told him to do.

Somebody has to take over from Sinfield i suppose

[cpwigan]

I think the positive is that every player representing England plays to a standard whereby opponents have to work very hard to beat them. Some are lacking in areas which holds our nation down and that is perhaps a reflection of SLs lack of strength / intensity.

I think rather than being that Sam has been worked out it is more that nations / clubs have moved on defensively in their attempts to deal with a lead line and a second line behind that. 2nd man play shave to be near perfect these days with defensive converging hard at the two runners. It has implications for ourselves as England seemed to be using Wigan plays. It is a tough gig to deliver. Close to the line it still remains a great ploy but more for tries in the corner to wingers.

The requirements with ball in hand are easier for NZ and Aus which is more or less the same for opponents when they play Wigan. If you look at both games, Englandfs return scoring wise was not commensurate with their early dominance in both games.

We did lose a lot when we had to make interchanges but it is hard to complain given Aus were even worse of. Sam B was the huge loss IMO. However, no Thurston is a similar loss.

We have had such golden opportunities but the margin between success / failure is minute. The Hall no try then today two conversions hitting the posts.

The big plusses for me are Clark who Wire have got a gem in for 2015 and beyond but equally Sarge. I honestly never envisaged the hopeless player we destroyed in a CC final becoming a full international. He has earned it and deserves it.

Ultimately we need more international RL, we need test series, we need tours. Today was a GREAT game to watch.

[Owd Codger]

Ryan Hall lost it for us, best winger in the world my arse

On this occasion, a correct comment.

Poor timing for the jump for the high ball, yards out of position for the second try like last week and failure to hold the ball for a try.

Peacock as usual turning a blind eye to the faults of his club mate., but had it been Charnley he would have had plenty to say!

And I hate saying this, but we badly missed Roby who can break a line, something which was badly missing at times.

We also need to cure the bad play of allowing the opposition to get the ball out of a tackle which was happening a lot.

[sc74]

For me, Australia and New Zealand seem to be able to score from anywhere, whereas England need a moment of magic.
Fair play to SMc for going with Sarg, but I think he needs replacing. Not sure who with though.

Who needs replacing, Sarge or McBanana?

Certainly not Sarge! It would be nice if newcomers to the club arent hounded by a minority and given the chance to settle in. It is Wigan after all and the expectation from all involved is massive.

[josie andrews]

For me, Australia and New Zealand seem to be able to score from anywhere, whereas England need a moment of magic.
Fair play to SMc for going with Sarg, but I think he needs replacing. Not sure who with though.

Who needs replacing, Sarge or McBanana?

Certainly not Sarge! It would be nice if newcomers to the club arent hounded by a minority and given the chance to settle in. It is Wigan after all and the expectation from all involved is massive.

I'm not hounding Sarge, but if you look at your post, the last name was Sarge before you said he needs replacing!

Why would I hound Sarge anyway, I run the sponsorship for him, if I didn't like him as a player, which IMO, I think he has improved tenfold since the start of the season, I would have asked if there was someone else to sponsor.

[thegimble]

For me, Australia and New Zealand seem to be able to score from anywhere, whereas England need a moment of magic.
Fair play to SMc for going with Sarg, but I think he needs replacing. Not sure who with though.

Who needs replacing, Sarge or McBanana?

Certainly not Sarge! It would be nice if newcomers to the club arent hounded by a minority and given the chance to settle in. It is Wigan after all and the expectation from all involved is massive.

You have a point towards some regarding especially unpopular players or coaches from poor sides that we take on.

Flower, Harris, Dudson, Clubb, Sarge, Gelling, Green, Smith etc. All been deemed not good enough by a few people only to be proven 9 times out of 10 wrong. All of them in the last 3 years

Though Josie is not one of the people who hounds players.

[Owd Codger]

Who needs replacing, Sarge or McBanana?

Certainly not Sarge! It would be nice if newcomers to the club arent hounded by a minority and given the chance to settle in. It is Wigan after all and the expectation from all involved is massive.

You have a point towards some regarding especially unpopular players or coaches from poor sides that we take on.

Flower, Harris, Dudson, Clubb, Sarge, Gelling, Green, Smith etc. All been deemed not good enough by a few people only to be proven 9 times out of 10 wrong. All of them in the last 3 years

Though Josie is not one of the people who hounds players.

Correct and no matter who the club sign, there will always be those who complain that they are not good enough.

Always has been and always will be.

[Wiganer Ted]

I'm sure it was mentioned earlier but having now watched the BBC Highlights show there really is a problems with the Kiwis first try.
Bromwich is in front of the kicker (Johnson I think) and is only 5-6 mtrs away from Nightingale when he catches the ball.
That's a no try every week in SL and should be in Intl Rugby too.
Another VR who can't give scoring decisions against his fellow countrymen!

[cpwigan]

Certainly not Sarge! It would be nice if newcomers to the club arent hounded by a minority and given the chance to settle in. It is Wigan after all and the expectation from all involved is massive.

You have a point towards some regarding especially unpopular players or coaches from poor sides that we take on.

Flower, Harris, Dudson, Clubb, Sarge, Gelling, Green, Smith etc. All been deemed not good enough by a few people only to be proven 9 times out of 10 wrong. All of them in the last 3 years

Though Josie is not one of the people who hounds players.

Correct and no matter who the club sign, there will always be those who complain that they are not good enough.

Always has been and always will be.

I think it is not negative BUT the expectation of Wigan fans when anybody pulls on the Cherry n White shirt is immense. Far greater than any other British RL Club. The high expectations and huge demands are why Wigan are the most successful RL club in British history.