Time for Noble to earn his corn

[bertina]

I understand that the coach cannot be blamed for players knocking on and throwing wild passes out, but team motivation and discipline are an integral part of the coaches job.
At the moment we are sadly lacking in both these departments. Also some of his team selections are really beginning to worry me.Enough has been said about Millard, that selection just defies belief, but that's not the only one. Why the hell did we not have more cover for the front row on the bench against Wakefield when it was blatantly obvious that Feka was'nt 100%?
It seems to me that the message being sent out to the players is "it does'nt matter how poorly you play because even though I express my disappointment in the press I will still pick you next week"
The coach takes the plaudits when the team is doing well, and so should carry some of the blame when we see crap like we had to suffer yesterday.
Time for Mr. Noble to stand up and be counted me thinks.

[robjoenz]

bertina posted:
I understand that the coach cannot be blamed for players knocking on and throwing wild passes out, but team motivation and discipline are an integral part of the coaches job.
At the moment we are sadly lacking in both these departments. Also some of his team selections are really beginning to worry me.Enough has been said about Millard, that selection just defies belief, but that's not the only one. Why the hell did we not have more cover for the front row on the bench against Wakefield when it was blatantly obvious that Feka was'nt 100%?
It seems to me that the message being sent out to the players is "it does'nt matter how poorly you play because even though I express my disappointment in the press I will still pick you next week"
The coach takes the plaudits when the team is doing well, and so should carry some of the blame when we see crap like we had to suffer yesterday.
Time for Mr. Noble to stand up and be counted me thinks.

He does take some of the blame and I agree that he is responsible for getting players to pick their game up through his coaching techniques.

One thing that he can't do is drop players for the next week. It's just not possible with the size of the squad he has to choose from.

[bertina]

robjoenz posted:

bertina posted:
I understand that the coach cannot be blamed for players knocking on and throwing wild passes out, but team motivation and discipline are an integral part of the coaches job.
At the moment we are sadly lacking in both these departments. Also some of his team selections are really beginning to worry me.Enough has been said about Millard, that selection just defies belief, but that's not the only one. Why the hell did we not have more cover for the front row on the bench against Wakefield when it was blatantly obvious that Feka was'nt 100%?
It seems to me that the message being sent out to the players is "it does'nt matter how poorly you play because even though I express my disappointment in the press I will still pick you next week"
The coach takes the plaudits when the team is doing well, and so should carry some of the blame when we see crap like we had to suffer yesterday.
Time for Mr. Noble to stand up and be counted me thinks.

He does take some of the blame and I agree that he is responsible for getting players to pick their game up through his coaching techniques.

One thing that he can't do is drop players for the next week. It's just not possible with the size of the squad he has to choose from.

Mcillorum for Millard, Goulding for Vaeliki, why not???

[DaveO]

I am convinced Noble contributed to the defeat v Wakey by putting three players returning from injury straight back into the side.

The side he put them into had previously thrashed Les Cats 30-0 so there was no need to rush them back and indeed more of a case for not changing a winning side.

Especially as we were supposed to be playing one of the "lesser" sides in the league so we were not in theory desperate for the services of these three players.

Nobby compounded the problem by as you say going with only three props when he must have known Feka was not 100%.

Seeing press reports of Noble saying Feka was to get more game time earlier in the week I was expecting to be reading headlines today as to how he single handedly tore Wakefield up. Instead I am reading reports on how one of their props ran 60m to score. Nobby must have known this was not going to happen yet left O'Carroll out.

He needs to act on his public statements and as he says "see who wants to be here". Anyone who he concludes does not needs to be dropped otherwise he won't have any respect from the players as they will know he never acts on what he says.

Dave

[robjoenz]

bertina posted:
Mcillorum for Millard, Goulding for Vaeliki, why not???

Every now and again, yes... but they'd not be able to keep up physically if it was week in week out.

[DaveO]

robjoenz posted:

bertina posted:
Mcillorum for Millard, Goulding for Vaeliki, why not???

Every now and again, yes... but they'd not be able to keep up physically if it was week in week out.

That argument does not wash in this case. Prior to Wakefield these two also had the same week off as the rest of the squad and in McIllorums case he has only played two SL games so burnout was not an issue.

That argument was no justification for not playing them v Wakefield. In fact with a week off and playing against one of the "lesser" teams is when I would expect such players to be given a run out. Especially when in McIllorum's case he had played well and his replacement was coming back from unjury.

They should both have played.

Post Wakefield Nobby needs to act on his public criticism of the players. I am sure those two can't be classed as players who don't want to be here and given there is no risk at the moment of burn out, they should get a game at the expense of players who screwed up in their positions v Wakey.

I'd go further and drop Hock because he is a liability at the moment. Hansen inthe starting 13 with Tomkins on the bench will improve out penalty count no end.

Noble does have limited room to manoeuvre but he has some with regard to these three positions so its time to get tough IMO.

However just as I suspected he would automatically pick Millard for the Wakey game I expect him to give us another "automatic" selection for the Bulls game. Same 20 again and same 18 again is my bet. Same result as well probably (if we are lucky).

Dave

[mike binder]

i straihgt ? why millard for mcluron??????

[phibes]

There's been a lot of talk this season about our inconsistent form being due to a new team needing time to gel. That's true - but poor basic skills and indiscipline have been an even bigger problem that goes back to Ian Millward's reign of terror.

It seems to me that there's an element of complacency in the team (regardless of the coach) and I'm not sure where it's coming from. Perhaps it's the shallow squad makes players feel too safe - perhaps it's because we don't have a Farrell figure on the park - or that we seem to facing a significant points deduction for the second year running.

Whatever it is, the coach has to sort it out - and one good start would be to introduce genuine competition for places - rather than just threatening to do it in the press.

[the-Bowtun-Warrior]

robjoenz posted:

bertina posted:
Mcillorum for Millard, Goulding for Vaeliki, why not???

Every now and again, yes... but they'd not be able to keep up physically if it was week in week out.

Agreed!

[GeoffN]

I completely agree with the "competition for places" argument; the problem is we don't have a strong enough or big enough squad to do that.
On yesterday's performance, at least 10 players should be dropped, but we don't have anything like that depth of cover.

McIlorum for Millard, of course, as we've been saying all along, and probably Goulding for DV, but that's about as far as it can go. Tomkins for Hock? Maybe, but Gareth was one the few yesterday who was showing any sort of passion (OK, too much at times, hence the penalties!).

The main underachievers yesterday, in my view, were Feca, Fielden, Hansen, Millard, Bailey, DV, Leuluai & Ashton. Drop Millard & DV, yep, but we don't really have replacements for the others.
Colbon on the wing, Richards to fullback? Coyle for Leuluai? Hill for Hansen? Prescott & O'Carroll starting with no props on the bench? I'm not convinced.