Wigan will be found NOT GUILTY

[shawcross da warrior]

please please please be true i need this news i am going away 2morra and need some good news top start this holiday off........

:eusa10: :eusa10: :eusa10:

[Fujiman]

pie eaters posted:

Cruncher posted:

pie eaters posted:
Wigan will never learn

How so?

wELL I am like everybody else , dont get me wrong i do not want any points deducted but if they do not get any then Lindsey and Whelan will think they can get away with it again next season thus putting us in the same position

How so? If we are not punished we haven't broken any rules :conf:

[Fujiman]

pie eaters posted:
Well come do not act so niave , we have broken the rules alot, why wasLindsey begging the RFL to go by last years rules and only deduct the 6 points, if Wigan had no case to answer then he would not care either way how many points would be deducted. How come it as taken so long for Wigan to get a case together when Bradford and Saints did it straight away.

If Wigan had done nothing wrong then it would not of taken this length of time and i think we can all expect the maximum penalty of 6 points and if you do not think it will happen then you are kidding yourself

Why did stains then join us in the case? They didn't have any points deducted

[Cruncher]

pie eaters posted:
Well come do not act so niave , we have broken the rules alot, why wasLindsey begging the RFL to go by last years rules and only deduct the 6 points, if Wigan had no case to answer then he would not care either way how many points would be deducted. How come it as taken so long for Wigan to get a case together when Bradford and Saints did it straight away.

If Wigan had done nothing wrong then it would not of taken this length of time and i think we can all expect the maximum penalty of 6 points and if you do not think it will happen then you are kidding yourself

In any circumstances, Wigan would have been totally remiss not to bring up the 2006 penalty points issue.

Firstly because it's only fair that offences committed in 2006 should be dealt with under 2006 rules, not under retrospective 2007 rules (otherwise it would have been "against natural justice", as the trial-judge himself said). Secondly, because anything can happen in a tribunal - even if Wigan felt they had a good case, things might have swung against them, so they were covering all eventualities. Thirdly, they might have felt that if they were to mount a serious challenge to the accusation and still lose, then, as sometimes happens in real court cases, a heavier penalty could be expected - in which case, it was because they felt they had a good case that they opted for the 2006 rules, not because they felt they had a poor one.

Of course, I don't know if any of this actually applies - I have no inside information. I merely mention it because I disagree with the regularly-aired assertion that Wigan asking for the 2006 rules automatically means they're guilty. It doesn't IMO, and I don't see why people keep assuming it does.

By the same token, why does the time lapse since the last tribunal automatically translate into Wigan being guilty? Why should it? In fact, couldn't you argue that yet again the opposite should be true - if Wigan are guilty, why delay when they've already won the points-penalty round? What's the point in stalling? Why not just take their punishment on the chin? To me, asking for an extra couple of weeks suggests that they're putting together a detailed case for the defence.

However, I reiterate - I don't KNOW anything. I'm as hopeful as everyone else, and maybe a little pessimistic that, unless we really do have a watertight case, we won't get off the hook at second time.

[Fujiman]

pie eaters posted:
I think there is something seriously wrong with how the club is being run behind the scenes. It just cannot go on, firstly Linsay was one of the main backers of the slary cap, yet as broken it the past couple of years. Then they agree that it should be doubled for anybody punished by going over the slary cap, yet goes out and buys Dobson and Fieldon for a world record fee. Then he backtracks and says that the new rules should not apply, then he gets the decision delayed for more time.

When he backed the cap it was a percentage of the clubs turnover rather than the present limit. If he didn't sign dobson or Fielden we probably would have gone down. Would you sooner that had happened?

[Lazy J]

pie eaters posted:
I think there is something seriously wrong with how the club is being run behind the scenes. It just cannot go on, firstly Linsay was one of the main backers of the slary cap, yet as broken it the past couple of years. Then they agree that it should be doubled for anybody punished by going over the slary cap, yet goes out and buys Dobson and Fieldon for a world record fee. Then he backtracks and says that the new rules should not apply, then he gets the decision delayed for more time.

You may be correct, there may be problems at the club, but lets not cloud the issue.

Mo may have voted to double the points deduction(I dont think he did though) but how can you change the rules halfway through a season? why not change a win to 5 points now lets double the value of a try and introduce the crap bonus point from NL1 I bet HKR will love that! you have to change rules from the start of something not halfway through, that was all Mo was arguing for which to me seems fair. if we go over this year we are screwed!

Mo did help introduce the salary cap, but he wasnt on his own! regarding the signings of Fielden and Dobbo, what did you want him to do sit back and watch us get relagated? he offloaded players left right and centre, look at SHudds and wignes, to try and get the squad under the cap. He brought in players that would do a job for our new coach that is his job, at the end of the day he got the club out of a situation it should never have been in, you could argue that was his doing but that is another topic.

[Exiled Wiganer]

Having worked with Mr Gay, our lawyer, over the years, he is the best in the business when it comes to this sort of hearing.
The RFL have hired a decent lawyer this time, but it is still National League against Super League.

We have given ourselves the best possible chance. If only Mo has given our lawyers enough to work with, we could well be fine.

[Fraggle]

pie eaters posted:
I think there is something seriously wrong with how the club is being run behind the scenes. It just cannot go on, firstly Linsay was one of the main backers of the slary cap, yet as broken it the past couple of years. Then they agree that it should be doubled for anybody punished by going over the slary cap, yet goes out and buys Dobson and Fieldon for a world record fee. Then he backtracks and says that the new rules should not apply, then he gets the decision delayed for more time.

Just to put all of these things into perspective:-

25/May/2006 - Wigan sign Dobson
22/June/2006 - Wigan sign Fielden
8/August/2006 - Wigan docked 2 points for salary cap breach in 2005.
(not sure on the date but later than 15/August/2006 since there was no mention of the change on any news story related to last year's salary cap deductions) - clubs agree to double the penalties for salary cap breaches

Dates taken from www.wiganrl.com

It's amazing how difficult it is to find any information about the meeting where the decision was made to double the points, it's as if the RFL have deleted all reference to it on the web although I've found discussion about it on RLFans from last October.

So by the time the decision was made to double the points, we would have already have been over the limit, if we are, infact, over the limit (which we won't know until later today). Our squad at the end of last season was smaller and therefore cheaper than it was in mid-July when the RFL investigated our salary cap situation.

All this stuff about Wigan deliberately breaking the cap again and again is misleading, because if we were over the cap, it was done BEFORE we had been officially told we were over the cap in the previous year. Of course, that's different to just blindly ignoring all the rules all along, but we made a case last year to say we thought we were within the rules, but that case was thrown out. And we're making a case this year as well, having done a huge amount of dealing to try and get under the cap...

(Reposted as I flagged as Automatic last time - definitely related to how long it takes you to type the message...!)

[jaws1]

When we signed Dobson and Fielden :

Dont forget Danny Hill and Jason McKavoy as well

[jollygiant3107]

jason mkavoy eh?????????.