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Just what did big Lesley think he was doing when he went over to the dark side, i had the misfortune to watch the onion game on saturday and thought that he couldnt have been more underused if he had stayed in the changing room.And I have to ask myself what is he hoping to achieve in the game, he cant kick and england dont want anyone who can run with the ball, all in all a very depressing evening and I predict that dissilusionment will quickly set in and Lesley will come back, as have so many of the others.

Therein lies the problem. The way union is played negates running rugby. In fact the team that tries to run and pass simply gets themselves into trouble.

same reason faz went over, for a nice payment package and to play competitive international rugby.

warrior till i die wrote:same reason faz went over, for a nice payment package and to play competitive international rugby.

Correct, plus the nationwide recognition which can do no harm to his earnings now or after he retires.

This is the reason also why we will never see Edwards back in our game.

I read that Lesley was unhappy about his england games. He has stated that he isnt getting enough of the ball compared to what type of player he is... he needs the ball, he says.

Like Jonty Edwards said on returning to RU:

Thats the first time i've been cold on a rugby pitch for ages

cpwigan wrote:Therein lies the problem. The way union is played negates running rugby. In fact the team that tries to run and pass simply gets themselves into trouble.

With the exception of the all blacks where the entire mindset is to play that style. It is the whole billy Whizz thing again with the difference that Jason even in his latter yrs had the pace to go around players where as big leslie tries to go through. If Les beats one or two players it is highly unlikely he will go the full length of the field due to the defence pattern of the union game as a pose to the league one line of defence with a fullback.

cpwigan wrote:Therein lies the problem. The way union is played negates running rugby. In fact the team that tries to run and pass simply gets themselves into trouble.

That isn't strictly true. That isn't the way NZ play the game and the French ran at the Irish a couple of weeks ago and scored a few tries that could have come right off an RL training pitch.

RU can end up with the wingers getting frost bite but it doesn't have to. It is just unfortunate for LV he chose to become "English" and play for the one international side who are seemingly incapable of playing a more expansive game.

Even some of the English RU commentators such as Brian Moore are doing their nuts that he isn't seeing more ball. I don't suppose that plonker Stuart Barnes is as that would be some sort of acknowledgement there is some value is an ex-RL player.

If they can't string enough passes together to get the ball out to him they ought to try him in one of the centre slots. Mind you that could be controversial because LV himself might just pass it to a winger which would never do!

Dave

warrior till i die wrote:same reason faz went over, for a nice payment package and to play competitive international rugby.

Problem union have they sign players and then think how to use them. Harris was prime example of that. WRU had no idea where to play him just wanted to sign him.

Faz even more so.

And Ashton a self proclaimed Wigan supporter not to know how to use him is a joke. Let him do what he did at Bradford bring him in and take on forwards. If ever a SL player is thinking of going to union then think about the amount of time oyull spen doing nothing all game. Apart from counting youor money.

jinkin jimmy wrote: This is the reason also why we will never see Edwards back in our game.

That doesn't necessarily follow: Coaches wages don't count in the salary cap. Agreed about the "recognition" aspect, though.

Unfortunately.

DaveO wrote:

cpwigan wrote:Therein lies the problem. The way union is played negates running rugby. In fact the team that tries to run and pass simply gets themselves into trouble.

That isn't strictly true. That isn't the way NZ play the game and the French ran at the Irish a couple of weeks ago and scored a few tries that could have come right off an RL training pitch.

RU can end up with the wingers getting frost bite but it doesn't have to. It is just unfortunate for LV he chose to become "English" and play for the one international side who are seemingly incapable of playing a more expansive game.

Even some of the English RU commentators such as Brian Moore are doing their nuts that he isn't seeing more ball. I don't suppose that plonker Stuart Barnes is as that would be some sort of acknowledgement there is some value is an ex-RL player.

If they can't string enough passes together to get the ball out to him they ought to try him in one of the centre slots. Mind you that could be controversial because LV himself might just pass it to a winger which would never do!

Dave

Unfortunately it is true Dave. The All Blacks, I think are fantastic but they fail at the highest level more often than not. Yet, they are clearly the best 'rugby' team. The successful teams? dour, % plays, kill the game. Only when the game is safely won will they try to play rugby.

WHY? well think about how Union restarts, to recycle the ball you have to keep in close support with your team mates. So passing the ball wide / running outwards is the worst tactic possible. Far greater chance of the ball carrier becoming isolated and having to turn over possession. So what you get are passes where the runner runs from out to in and back into the mass of bodies from a previous ruck/maul/scrum/lineout in order to ensure possession can be retained/recycled. England prove my point. When they try to play rugby they get beaten, when they kill the game they often win.