Will The Crusaders Experiment Work?

[Shaun1967]

I genuinely hope that we can establish a side in Wales, but I can’t help feeling this is going to go sadly wrong.

Despite all the euphoria surrounding a new club who put in a reasonable performance against the reigning champs last week, they managed to bring around a dozen fans tonight to what is arguably the marquee game of Rugby League – playing Wigan.
I don’t blame the Crusaders themselves and think that it would be great if they were successful, however this surely must bring into question the franchise system and more so, the people who administer it.
In moving the Celtic club north:
· They have lost their team (did any player tonight play for them last year?).
· They have lost an excellent coach in John Dixon without whom they would probably never have been in a position to apply for a franchise.
· They have lost their entire fan base that they had just spent 2 years building.
· They have appointed a coach (no disrespect to him in this statement; but) who is not going to establish a youth structure or promote youth from within the club. i.e. they are going to rely on overseas rejects for the foreseeable future.
· They have just been taken over by a football club who were recently in administration.
· Their ground does not meet the criteria laid out by the franchise system.

I hope that they can be successful, but surely the franchise system is flawed. There cannot be any diligent checks in place to grant a franchise to a club who are financially unviable within 1 year.
I can fully understand the frustration of clubs like Widnes, Barrow, Halifax, (not Leigh because if the game was run properly they would be relegated).
Catalans have shown that expansion can work, but you cannot force it upon a region and expect to gain credibility for the game.

[gpartin]

Absolute joke isn't it. Was just posting on similar lines on another thread. The Celtic fans I have spoken to are gutted and I suspect some of them will be put off rugby league by it.

[The Eclipse]

I would love to see the Crusaders work more than anyone, but it is not going to happen, especially with Noble at the helm.

They should've appointed Iestyn Harris as coach because he has Wales Rugby League's best interests at heart whereas Noble only cares about himself.

No fans will want to watch a team of second and third rate imports (players like Trimarchi and Youngquest struggled to standout in under 20s) getting flogged week after week and the young Welsh talent will lose interest because they won't get a game.

Sad but very realistic conclusions.

[ancientnloyal]

Surely it isnt healthy having an empty stand when the away side is 40 miles away. Note to Huddersfield also. Wouldn't be much to take 4 free coaches up (200 fans) for their new fanbase against the biggest club in the world now would it? how did crusaders market it? "wigan v crusaders ticket info" on their website? that it?

For example, warrington to Hull KR is quite a distance and they still bring a decent crowd.

[adiddy]

It will work, the RFL will make it work, but also re the fan base, it will take time for them to identify with the club to be fans enough to travel to away games! The amount of dads with kids last week on Tv was extremely encouraging and in time they will start to travel! I only live 30mins away from Wrexham so when it doesnt intefere with watching wigan I will watch Crusaders, they need support not critiscm! We should welcome them, I know Widnes etc have been screwed but there is nothing we can do about it! We now have a new team in the north of wales, lets hope they become successful and not fold and give us yet more negative national publicity!

Matt

[Mike]

A fair question, but I think some of your criticisms are inaccurate.

In moving the Celtic club north:
· They have lost their team (did any player tonight play for them last year?).

They lost 6 players due to visa problems, not the move north. I counted 8 players that played today that played against us last season. Undoubtedly the uncertainty over their future in the offseason did lose them some players.

· They have lost an excellent coach in John Dixon without whom they would probably never have been in a position to apply for a franchise.

He left before the move north, they didn't renew his contract.

· They have lost their entire fan base that they had just spent 2 years building.

True. Thats the most disappointing aspect of the move. They have been around since 2006 and started at the bottom of the pyramid, which IMO is the right way to setup a club with long term potential. This makes their abandonment of their fan base doubly disapointing.

· They have appointed a coach (no disrespect to him in this statement; but) who is not going to establish a youth structure or promote youth from within the club. i.e. they are going to rely on overseas rejects for the foreseeable future.

Maybe thats true too. However, he is a high-profile coach that gives the club credibility and appears to be ambitious despite what recent experiences at Wigan may have been.

· They have just been taken over by a football club who were recently in administration.
· Their ground does not meet the criteria laid out by the franchise system.

The footy team aren't doing very well, and I agree that it is odd that they want to take on a loss-making RL side. After all even we struggle to break-even each season, so what hope do Wrexham have of making money from the Crusaders. This seems to be the most likely outcome to me - the footy team discover that RL teams lose money and they withdraw their support after one season.

I hope that they can be successful, but surely the franchise system is flawed. There cannot be any diligent checks in place to grant a franchise to a club who are financially unviable within 1 year.

They were financially viable, just like many other businesses. Then the recession hit, took out Leighton Samuels businesses and suddenly he couldn't afford to fund his club any more. It takes more than one season to make a SL club that can break even, and I think thats the problem Wrexham are going to hit at the end of this year. Then we will see their commitment.

I can fully understand the frustration of clubs like Widnes, Barrow, Halifax, (not Leigh because if the game was run properly they would be relegated).
Catalans have shown that expansion can work, but you cannot force it upon a region and expect to gain credibility for the game.

Don't forget that Celtic (as was) would have been promoted with Salford in 2008 based on their playing performance if we still used that system. SO the other teams don't have much to complain about on that basis.

[FROM A TO B]

As posted elswhere, the people that manage the clubs exposure need to take a long hard look at how to expand the fan base.
Last week, in the regin of 8k home supporters turned up in the snow. Lots of plugs during the match for next home games,how often did they mention they were away to Wigan and that it is only 45 minutes away? Not once.

They have to realise that in order to build up supporters, they need to have a bond with the team and an identity.

Will it work long term? Who knows?
Will London be the next "franchise" to move further "up north".
Remember Gateshead / Hull merger to form the Thunder? How long did that last before Hull FC were refomed and as if by magic in SL? Do we here anyone asking why Hull FC are allowed to be in the SL?

OK, perhaps I'm biased with Wrexham only being 20 mins away, but in the end, you can't hold the players or coaching staff responsible for the move.

[ancientnloyal]

As mentioned above, I believe a new club should start from the bottom like Celtic did in 2006 and work their way up, adding support year on year. Obviously they wouldn't get 8,000 fans playing the Skolars but a few hundred each year will be suffice. Not only do the RFL have to look at home attendances but also contributions a club has to away support. I believe most clubs don't do enough to encourage supporters to travel even Wigan and Saints. Coach partners are fine but would like to see more of it.

[medlocke]

already failed, rfl should stop taking the pee and get rid, bring in Barrow before Widnes and jobs a good one, There will be support for a Cumbrian SL team, i can see Barrow adding at least another 2k fans from around the immediate and outlying areas

[Mike]

so thats 2000 more than the 1000 fans they currently get? Not as many as London?