Wayne Mcdonald

[GeoffN]

DaveO posted:
The RFL aren't completely stupid.

Dave

Is that a fact?

[ChrisA]

we_need_a_coach posted:

mrs_carney posted:
If he does that then nobody (except wnac) can complain!!!

mrs_carney posted

I'm sorry again Mrs_carney, but IMO Leeds would not let a decent player go at this point in the season, especially to Wigan, unless they where convinced he could'nt help us.
He's too Tall and not very facst or agile, according to the Leeds fans on their web site, not rated by them at all, and obviously not rated by their coaches, when you consider how many times he started for them !!
we need to attract some experience with ability, this man is certainly not that !!

And as if all this was not enough, Radlinski pulls out for tomorrow, could it get any worse ???

Or is it all part of a larger plan

All the reasons you quote as being the reasons you dont rate him as a loan signing, are exactly the same reasons why we cant go and sign Stuart Fielden or Mark O'meley, they are all contracted. You sit here slagging off every move the club makes, yet what else are they supposed to do ? I have an idea lets wave the "magic give me a world class prop wand".
THERES NOBODY WE CAN GET. So we will have to make do with loan signings, they wont be world beaters, who would release a world class player for no reason at all ? thats right nobody.

At times wnac, you annoy me more than Ian Millward does, you rant about stuff that cant be helped now, yet when we try to do somthin you still bitch.

You need to realise that we are pretty stuffed for this season as far as new signings go, unles somthing crazy happens like Jason Ryles gets sacked and fancies slumming it for a while in a mediocre English side where the weathers crap and he will lose any chance of Origin or reprasentative honuors.

[we_need_a_coach]

ChrisA posted:

we_need_a_coach posted:

mrs_carney posted:
If he does that then nobody (except wnac) can complain!!!

mrs_carney posted

I'm sorry again Mrs_carney, but IMO Leeds would not let a decent player go at this point in the season, especially to Wigan, unless they where convinced he could'nt help us.
He's too Tall and not very facst or agile, according to the Leeds fans on their web site, not rated by them at all, and obviously not rated by their coaches, when you consider how many times he started for them !!
we need to attract some experience with ability, this man is certainly not that !!

And as if all this was not enough, Radlinski pulls out for tomorrow, could it get any worse ???

Or is it all part of a larger plan

All the reasons you quote as being the reasons you dont rate him as a loan signing, are exactly the same reasons why we cant go and sign Stuart Fielden or Mark O'meley, they are all contracted. You sit here slagging off every move the club makes, yet what else are they supposed to do ? I have an idea lets wave the "magic give me a world class prop wand".
THERES NOBODY WE CAN GET. So we will have to make do with loan signings, they wont be world beaters, who would release a world class player for no reason at all ? thats right nobody.

At times wnac, you annoy me more than Ian Millward does, you rant about stuff that cant be helped now, yet when we try to do somthin you still bitch.

You need to realise that we are pretty stuffed for this season as far as new signings go, unles somthing crazy happens like Jason Ryles gets sacked and fancies slumming it for a while in a mediocre English side where the weathers crap and he will lose any chance of Origin or reprasentative honuors.

I have been waiting for someone to say what you said in your last Paragraph. We are a mediocre side, it has'nt just happened this has been coming for 4-5 years, the reason no one will come... we don't have the pull any more, it's not just for this season though, the top players will be looking for moves to Leeds, Bradford, StHelens, Hull. Because they are now competing for the trophies.
We have to get back to basics, like Bradford, Leeds and StHelens did all those years ago, most of us would'nt mind a few poor seasons if we could see a plan and improvement.
Under the current incumbants, I'm afraid we will fall even lower, if DW sells out to some consortim, and we have to find a new ground....What the hells going on here !!!!!

[hes84]

i think it's a loan move.
you should all give the guy a chnace before you start putting him down.he's done alright for us in leeds.i admit he is very hit and miss but players play differentley in different teams.maybe playing with the rest of the wigan squad might change how macdonald plays!!

[Fraggle]

we_need_a_coach posted:
We have to get back to basics, like Bradford, Leeds and StHelens did all those years ago, most of us would'nt mind a few poor seasons if we could see a plan and improvement.
Under the current incumbants, I'm afraid we will fall even lower, if DW sells out to some consortim, and we have to find a new ground....What the hells going on here !!!!!

Now this is where you've always confused me. Point 1, you say go back to basics. For those other clubs that's meant changing coaches, players, backroom staff, the ground (to some extent, in the case of Bradford), the board (in the case of St Helens)...

Point 2, you worry about changes to the ground, the board, the owner... many of the things which are part of "going back to basics". This going back to basics needs something a bit more radical than just changing the coach, as you keep saying it also means maybe changing the chairman or board. But DW very probably won't do that, so if you want those things to happen you need a new owner as well.

The ground change is still highly unlikely, for the reasons previously mentioned. DW isn't stupid, and isn't going to turn down the chance of making money by kicking a profitable income out of his stadium. Obviously I don't know about gameday costs, but taking a crowd figure of 13000 (say 6500 adults, 6500 children) brings in something like £150k (based on average ticket prices of £10/concessions; £14/adults), or £2m for the home games in a season (excluding cup games, play-offs etc - all figures are educated guesses not based on actual figures). Ok, so that would only buy about a leg of a premiership football but it's also not to be sniffed at. Is DW daft enough to turn down £2m in gate receipts? Remember, when you buy tickets, the money goes to Wigan Football Club Ltd, which is not the Warriors nor the Latics, it's another part of the whole Whelan empire.

[DaveO]

heydude posted:
but he's is not just under the rfl he also comes under rfu and somehow i don't think he would play for less than 20k in two sports when he could probably get the same amount just to play one of them or more if he just played union.

Well for one thing he isn't actually playing RU at the minute being part of Leeds first team squad.

However it doesn't matter who he is under. Leeds Rugby can't pay him more than £20K without being in contravention of the rules if he is indeed one of the plyers on less than £20K as the Rhinos fans seem to think. As a registered RL player he gets his wages from Leeds Rugby and so if they paid him £20K for playing RL and £40K for RU the RFL would class him in the top 20. This is because he is considered by the RFL as a professional player and therefore ALL his income is classed as being earned for being a professional RL player.

That is how they prevent the likes of our players being paid a pittance for actually playing the game but a fortune for being a development officer or something.

If it were that easy to get around these rules we would not be having a discussion about McDonald but more likely Webke, we would not be moaning that Farrell is still being paid and thus on affecting the salary cap and we would not be concerned about which of our young kids we need to release when they can command a wage of more than £20K because we have not got enough slots available on the 20/20.

FYI another Leeds player who is paids less than £20K is Francis Cummins. Another one who is not a young lad and he is not dual code either. He was given a contract by Leeds last season at this level for various reasons I can't remember but there was a big debate ahout it on rkfans.

Dave

[we_need_a_coach]

Fraggle posted:

we_need_a_coach posted:
We have to get back to basics, like Bradford, Leeds and StHelens did all those years ago, most of us would'nt mind a few poor seasons if we could see a plan and improvement.
Under the current incumbants, I'm afraid we will fall even lower, if DW sells out to some consortim, and we have to find a new ground....What the hells going on here !!!!!

Now this is where you've always confused me. Point 1, you say go back to basics. For those other clubs that's meant changing coaches, players, backroom staff, the ground (to some extent, in the case of Bradford), the board (in the case of St Helens)...

Point 2, you worry about changes to the ground, the board, the owner... many of the things which are part of "going back to basics". This going back to basics needs something a bit more radical than just changing the coach, as you keep saying it also means maybe changing the chairman or board. But DW very probably won't do that, so if you want those things to happen you need a new owner as well.

The ground change is still highly unlikely, for the reasons previously mentioned. DW isn't stupid, and isn't going to turn down the chance of making money by kicking a profitable income out of his stadium. Obviously I don't know about gameday costs, but taking a crowd figure of 13000 (say 6500 adults, 6500 children) brings in something like £150k (based on average ticket prices of £10/concessions; £14/adults), or £2m for the home games in a season (excluding cup games, play-offs etc - all figures are educated guesses not based on actual figures). Ok, so that would only buy about a leg of a premiership football but it's also not to be sniffed at. Is DW daft enough to turn down £2m in gate receipts? Remember, when you buy tickets, the money goes to Wigan Football Club Ltd, which is not the Warriors nor the Latics, it's another part of the whole Whelan empire.

I am under no illusions, If the Latics get to the Premiership, we will be disgarded within 18 months, DW may wait to see if the Latics stay up and consolidate, if they do, IMO we will be sold and relocated outside of town, I know it's negative, but I can't see any other outcome. DW has a dream of Prem fotball, and he has said all along he wants to be involved in the game at the highest level, well this is his chance. And I for one don't think he will allow anything to get in his way.

[heydude]

DaveO posted:

heydude posted:
but he's is not just under the rfl he also comes under rfu and somehow i don't think he would play for less than 20k in two sports when he could probably get the same amount just to play one of them or more if he just played union.

Well for one thing he isn't actually playing RU at the minute being part of Leeds first team squad.

However it doesn't matter who he is under. Leeds Rugby can't pay him more than £20K without being in contravention of the rules if he is indeed one of the plyers on less than £20K as the Rhinos fans seem to think. As a registered RL player he gets his wages from Leeds Rugby and so if they paid him £20K for playing RL and £40K for RU the RFL would class him in the top 20. This is because he is considered by the RFL as a professional player and therefore ALL his income is classed as being earned for being a professional RL player.

That is how they prevent the likes of our players being paid a pittance for actually playing the game but a fortune for being a development officer or something.

If it were that easy to get around these rules we would not be having a discussion about McDonald but more likely Webke, we would not be moaning that Farrell is still being paid and thus on affecting the salary cap and we would not be concerned about which of our young kids we need to release when they can command a wage of more than £20K because we have not got enough slots available on the 20/20.

FYI another Leeds player who is paids less than £20K is Francis Cummins. Another one who is not a young lad and he is not dual code either. He was given a contract by Leeds last season at this level for various reasons I can't remember but there was a big debate ahout it on rkfans.

Dave

but isn't Francis cummins some sort of community development officer (something like that) aswell. :sly:

[DaveO]

heydude posted:

DaveO posted:

heydude posted:
but he's is not just under the rfl he also comes under rfu and somehow i don't think he would play for less than 20k in two sports when he could probably get the same amount just to play one of them or more if he just played union.

Well for one thing he isn't actually playing RU at the minute being part of Leeds first team squad.

However it doesn't matter who he is under. Leeds Rugby can't pay him more than £20K without being in contravention of the rules if he is indeed one of the plyers on less than £20K as the Rhinos fans seem to think. As a registered RL player he gets his wages from Leeds Rugby and so if they paid him £20K for playing RL and £40K for RU the RFL would class him in the top 20. This is because he is considered by the RFL as a professional player and therefore ALL his income is classed as being earned for being a professional RL player.

That is how they prevent the likes of our players being paid a pittance for actually playing the game but a fortune for being a development officer or something.

If it were that easy to get around these rules we would not be having a discussion about McDonald but more likely Webke, we would not be moaning that Farrell is still being paid and thus on affecting the salary cap and we would not be concerned about which of our young kids we need to release when they can command a wage of more than £20K because we have not got enough slots available on the 20/20.

FYI another Leeds player who is paids less than £20K is Francis Cummins. Another one who is not a young lad and he is not dual code either. He was given a contract by Leeds last season at this level for various reasons I can't remember but there was a big debate ahout it on rkfans.

Dave

but isn't Francis cummins some sort of community development officer (something like that) aswell. :sly:

If he is, it can't be for Leeds Rugby or rather he can't be paid by them in such a way to take him over £20K if he is one of Leeds under-£20K players.

Dave

[Fraggle]

we_need_a_coach posted:
I am under no illusions, If the Latics get to the Premiership, we will be disgarded within 18 months, DW may wait to see if the Latics stay up and consolidate, if they do, IMO we will be sold and relocated outside of town, I know it's negative, but I can't see any other outcome. DW has a dream of Prem fotball, and he has said all along he wants to be involved in the game at the highest level, well this is his chance. And I for one don't think he will allow anything to get in his way.

But I don't see why his dream of Premiership football needs to have any effect on us at all. He doesn't have much input now, he's too busy arguing with Greater Manchester Police. As has been said repeatedly, there are no rules to say rugby league and soccer can't co-exist in the same stadium. One sport is in summer, one is in winter, and if anything it's the rugby team who suffer from the state of the pitch when our season starts rather than the soccer team suffering when their season starts. Both teams are tenants at the ground, they just happen to be owned by the same person. We don't get in the way of the Latics at all, indeed we help bring money into Whelco Holdings or whatever the umbrella organisation is called and DW's not likely to turn down the chance for more money for his stadium even if he no longer has anything to do with Wigan RLFC.