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Early on in the season we were putting in really good performances and yes we were down on men but we were still turning up playing a good brand of rugby.

Over the last id say 4 games we have dissolved into what can only be described as a bit of a shambles. Our end plays on sets last night were as bad as theyve been this year. You could look at injuries but to be the only memeber of the spine (the direction) that has been missing recently is lockers. The main spine is still playing so while i would imagine yes we may not end the set with a try but last night we looked at times like we didn't know it was the fifth tackle half of the time. On at least 3 occasions the last tackle play was a complete panic job Liam Farrell ending up with the kicking on 2 occasions and George panicky jumping round looking for an option on another before being tackled with the ball.

This is not a shot at either of those players or in fact an expectation we would play great without a full strength team, my worry simply lives in the fact we still have our starting half backs,full back and hooker (albeit he did go off for a bit last night) so the last tackle play should still be as thought out if not perfectly executed.

Personally i think the balance of work being taken on by Tommy and George is un-even, it seems like we are just lobbing it to GW most the time and saying "go on do something".

This brings me to my topic title, is lockers despite the maturing Williams and Old Head Tommy still the glue holding our attack and direction together?, or is it something else?

Wigan_forever19​85​ wrote: This brings me to my topic title, is lockers despite the maturing Williams and Old Head Tommy still the glue holding our attack and direction together?, or is it something else?

I think it's something else, but Lockers fixes that something else when he plays.

I don't see Tommy or George as being great talkers or organisers when the chips are down. Lockers and Sam T provide that for the team if they were playing.

George is a great off the cuff player who has the speed, step and offload to pull that off. But neither half seems to be able to switch up the pattern of play or make tactical in game calls about our attack. Neither steps foot on the other's side of the pitch other than by accident it appears. They never do a late switch of sides at the ruck or anything. So if you make your one-on-one wins in defence and keep our speed of ruck quite slow against us, then stop George's magic feet or read his kicks, we lack threat in our attack.

Basically, when our extra pivots aren't playing (Lockers & Sam) and we're not consistently getting quick potbs (usually when Farrell and Bateman aren't playing we don't play the ball as fast) and Gelling's eccentricity isn't playing, we need to come up with some new set plays to ask out opponents questions, because the normal moves just don't work as well.

markill wrote:

Wigan_forever19​85​ wrote: This brings me to my topic title, is lockers despite the maturing Williams and Old Head Tommy still the glue holding our attack and direction together?, or is it something else?

I think it's something else, but Lockers fixes that something else when he plays.

I don't see Tommy or George as being great talkers or organisers when the chips are down. Lockers and Sam T provide that for the team if they were playing.

George is a great off the cuff player who has the speed, step and offload to pull that off. But neither half seems to be able to switch up the pattern of play or make tactical in game calls about our attack. Neither steps foot on the other's side of the pitch other than by accident it appears. They never do a late switch of sides at the ruck or anything. So if you make your one-on-one wins in defence and keep our speed of ruck quite slow against us, then stop George's magic feet or read his kicks, we lack threat in our attack.

Basically, when our extra pivots aren't playing (Lockers & Sam) and we're not consistently getting quick potbs (usually when Farrell and Bateman aren't playing we don't play the ball as fast) and Gelling's eccentricity isn't playing, we need to come up with some new set plays to ask out opponents questions, because the normal moves just don't work as well.

Agree with all that. We looked tired last night.

I think Bri hit the nail on the head; Fatigue! Players look tired to the point of shattered.

If thats the case you have to ask yourself why? i mean we are at the start of the season, yes we have players missing but none of them in what you would refer to the "engine" room - added to that younger players should bring freshness with them

Lockers, Sam and MM would improve the spine of any team in my opinion so yes I think him being out injured along with the other 2 is a massive loss, providing they can all play to a standard that they once gave us. One thing guaranteed from all 3 is a desire and leadership that with so many youngsters in is lacking!!

MM is a backwards step compared to Powell

Fit healthy player are a positive for every club. Mac and Sam vying for the hooking position would be great.

Wormburner wrote:MM is a backwards step compared to Powell

You have got to ne joking. Our pack is getting battered every week and MM's aggression is being sorely missed.

TrueBlueWarrior wrote:Lockers, Sam and MM would improve the spine of any team in my opinion so yes I think him being out injured along with the other 2 is a massive loss, providing they can all play to a standard that they once gave us. One thing guaranteed from all 3 is a desire and leadership that with so many youngsters in is lacking!!

Sam and mm though weren't playing at the start of the season either when we're playing quite well imo but we seem to have taken a massive dip in the last few games and the only change to the spine has been lockers