WiganWarriorsFans.com

Brennox7 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 12:38 pm Will we need cooper next season?

Just thinking with Dupree, Ellis, Byrne, Havard and possibility Walters in there?

I think all of the above get in the match day 17. We’ve also got Harvie Hill coming through and we don’t know what’s happening with Mago?

Chan.

Charriots Offiah wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 10:31 pm

nathan_rugby wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 6:53 pm Anyone got any idea on the average age of starting 17 forwards in Super League winning teams?

History shows us experience is vital in the forwards, especially props, but wondering what the data says?

A bit worried about our lack of experience.

Our squads average age is the youngest in SL and it looks like it is going lower.

Which is what really really worries me and hence looking for some stats on average forward age winning super league.

Don’t have the stats to back it up but based on memory it’s always weighted ok the older end, at least with the props.

nathan_rugby wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 6:43 am

Charriots Offiah wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 10:31 pm

nathan_rugby wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 6:53 pm Anyone got any idea on the average age of starting 17 forwards in Super League winning teams?

History shows us experience is vital in the forwards, especially props, but wondering what the data says?

A bit worried about our lack of experience.

Our squads average age is the youngest in SL and it looks like it is going lower.

Which is what really really worries me and hence looking for some stats on average forward age winning super league.

Don’t have the stats to back it up but based on memory it’s always weighted ok the older end, at least with the props.

We need at least one more experienced forward and to keep Cooper IMO for that reason. I just don’t see us having enough leadership and know how without sorting that out. It’s a real issue for this season as well and I’d look to get Powell back in the 17 for that reason but it needs addressing even more so for 2024. Nobody has an issue with Powell the player going but you do lose that experience and leadership and the same goes for Willie Isa.

It’s coming to the time now were guys like Smithies and Havard need to take a step up in terms of leadership but they need help around them.

Working on stats for age of props in GF, 2000-2022.

NICKYKISS wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 8:09 am

nathan_rugby wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 6:43 am

Charriots Offiah wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 10:31 pm

Our squads average age is the youngest in SL and it looks like it is going lower.

Which is what really really worries me and hence looking for some stats on average forward age winning super league.

Don’t have the stats to back it up but based on memory it’s always weighted ok the older end, at least with the props.

We need at least one more experienced forward and to keep Cooper IMO for that reason. I just don’t see us having enough leadership and know how without sorting that out. It’s a real issue for this season as well and I’d look to get Powell back in the 17 for that reason but it needs addressing even more so for 2024. Nobody has an issue with Powell the player going but you do lose that experience and leadership and the same goes for Willie Isa.

It’s coming to the time now were guys like Smithies and Havard need to take a step up in terms of leadership but they need help around them.

Powell would be great to keep on as a replacement 13 but the money he’s on I doubt it probably makes no sense to do that

nathan_rugby wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 6:53 pm Anyone got any idea on the average age of starting 17 forwards in Super League winning teams?

History shows us experience is vital in the forwards, especially props, but wondering what the data says?

A bit worried about our lack of experience.

Nathan, you got me started on a fairly long, tedious look at data.
For me the age/experience thing is about props rather than forwards in general. I thought I'd look at the age of props in teams that got to the Grand Final.

• All GFs from 2000 to 2022 inclusive.
• Starting props only, as it's too time-consuming to check subs and who played where.
• I've ignored who won and lost, because that's down to the whole squad. §
• None of this has any statistical significance, ie it doesn't prove anything. It's just for my curiosity.

~The average age of starting props, '00-'22 was 28.16 years.

~ The majority of props in GFs (62%) were between 24 and 31.

~ The youngest was Jamie Peacock, age 20 in the 2007 GF. Ryan Bailey was 21 in the 2004 GF.

~ The youngest paring was Danny Ward, age 24, and Ryan Bailey, 21, in 2004. Leeds won.

~ Oldest were 35: Darren Britt ('02), Paul Anderson ('06), James Graham ('20), Matt Prior ('22). For the record, 3 of them were losers and 1 winner (but see § above.)

~ Fwiw, the teams with older props won 10 finals and lost 13.

On another note: Can you remember these props and who they played for?

Paul Wood, Brad Meyers, Jason Cayless, Ben Harrison, Darren Britt.

Warrington
Bradford
St Helens
Warrington
St Helens?

Big stick wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 1:21 pm

NICKYKISS wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 8:09 am

nathan_rugby wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 6:43 am

Which is what really really worries me and hence looking for some stats on average forward age winning super league.

Don’t have the stats to back it up but based on memory it’s always weighted ok the older end, at least with the props.

We need at least one more experienced forward and to keep Cooper IMO for that reason. I just don’t see us having enough leadership and know how without sorting that out. It’s a real issue for this season as well and I’d look to get Powell back in the 17 for that reason but it needs addressing even more so for 2024. Nobody has an issue with Powell the player going but you do lose that experience and leadership and the same goes for Willie Isa.

It’s coming to the time now were guys like Smithies and Havard need to take a step up in terms of leadership but they need help around them.

Powell would be great to keep on as a replacement 13 but the money he’s on I doubt it probably makes no sense to do that

Possibly but when you think Shorrocks is younger, cheaper and probably better (as a 13), I think he’s the man who’ll back up Smithies. I just can’t see how Powell stays tbh. I don’t think we sign Leeming without knowing Powell is going elsewhere. I look across the league and a few clubs make sense (Leigh, Catalans, Salford and Huddersfield). You lose experience and that’s the main worry. I wouldn’t have been against keeping Isa on but his injury record this season has been a major worry.

josie andrews wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 3:38 pm Warrington
Bradford
St Helens
Warrington
St Helens?

5/5 Josie. Brilliant!!

To be honest, it's miles better than I did. I'd forgotten Britt and Meyers existed, and only vaguely remember Cayless.

The years were

Wood '13
Meyers '05
Cayless '06 and '07
Harrison '12
Britt '02