The biggest failing of Wane

[cpwigan]

Why should Dave O not be allowed to express his opinion, particularly when his view has credence. You could argue it was history repeating itself; first Murphy then Tierney fed to the wolves. Whatsmore, if Murphy was supposedly ready a year ago in a far bigger game and has since gained SL experience at Salford and Championship experience at South Wales why is he not selected or even mentioned a year ago by Wane now? Surely it begs questions re his judgement? Forget hindsight etc. We are talking the last 12 months.

I think Tierney has potential. He is not ready yet BUT for those that do not know Tierney has missed a large portion of the season with injury. Yet as soon as he returns he is rushed into the first team by Wane. Dury of care?

Even better, the most talented junior at the club, Hampshire; in outstanding form even covered for Tierney during his absence. Made a fantastic cameo effort that was praised by Wane. What happens; never played since?

Why throw youngsters in as a last resort? Why has Sam not been rested more when we have a fully fit team out there as either Murphy, Tierney or Hampshire given games when we are dominant. What is more valuable? Bullying teams to 60/80 nil or winning by 40 AND giving a youngster an opportunity to gain experience. After all Wane said pre season, Sam would be going and we need to give youngsters opportunities.

Similarly stupid; Why throw a convert to the wolves when Wane says he is 6 weeks + off being ready. Why not give Greenwood another opportunity? Why was Spencer allowed to play and get injured at Leigh? Both big lumps, ideal in wet conditions.

We have a coach who makes crazy selection decisions and has a Walter Mitty utopian Gary Schofield philosophy on how to play RL. I will leave you a though; NOT MINE BTW; Offered by Gibson, Bennett and other top coaches. You create a game plan based on the players at your disposal, one that maximises their strengths; you do not impose your dream game plan upon players not suited to delivering it.

[devon jim 1]

I agree to a degree to what you say CP but it is dfeasible or if not there;s an old saying;A person who never made a mistake(s) never did anything. not that I condowne the making of too many mistakes

[thegimble]

DaveO you are also the master of hindsight, I guarantee if Pat would have played FB and we still would have lost, you would have been saying we should have played Tierney at FB he did well against Widnes!! Hindsight Master should be your new name!

Yeah i agree with that for a lot of people on here. Pat Richards made just as big an error as Tierney did. But hindsight is a glorious thing to justify oneself.

So in future when something goes wrong you are never going to offer an opinion suggesting something could have been done differently?

Are people banned from offering such opinions because they weren't Mystic Meg and didn't predict it beforehand?

Did you mention or anyone else that Tierney was not ready after the Widnes game.

As for offering an opinion hows this for hindsight i did not post this last week as i know the reaction i would have got. I would have played a weaken side at Wire taken the battering and put out a stronger side against Cas and been 3 points clear today. Rested Sam, Faz, Mossop and 1 or 2 more. Gives a chance that finishing top 2 and rest players towards the last 2 weeks of the season.

I generally have no issues with your opinions it seems that some might. My issue is with the geniuses who said nothing for 14 weeks. But were complaining about Wane during the Hock situation. Its obvious 1 or 2 on here can not be objective when it comes to him. He does make mistakes and Murphy last season was the biggey. But name me a coach that got it right every time. Even Madge bollocked it after the CC final when he played the full team against Crusaders and we looked shot to pieces but tbh even that season we were not the side we were towards August on-wards.

Wanes biggest fault is IL is happy to let players go mid contract and thus weakness the squad. But i bet for 1 or 2 that is Wanes fault.

[cpwigan]

Jim everybody is entitled to an opinion and to be honest the more opinions, the better it is for any forum. Unlike yourself, people launching petty name calling at another poster is not productive for anybody. One person has been acting like this towards Dave O for several weeks. Whether one agrees or disagrees with Dave O, his posts are 99% of time interesting and worth reading.

[cpwigan]

Cherry you right IMO re Murphy but the problem I have is our coach held a different opinion 12 months ago when it mattered and since then the player may as well not exist. If Wane believed that particular player had enough ability to play in the biggest game of the season 12 months ago why not now in far less important games. At the present time I would select Murphy ahead of Tierney although I think Tierney will eventually be the better player.

Similarly, Wane again showed his inability when dealing with the media. IMO he should be permanently gagged by IL. His comment 'it was either Powell or Coley' was that of an imbecile however he intended it. Whatsmore, the decision smacks IMO of a publicity stunt (ultimately gone wrong), perhaps enforced upon him by IL. Spencer and Greenwood whether they are the future would both have run their blood to water and must be hurt/offended by the Wane comment. Lets face it, the Cas pack is nothing special but they too will run their blood to water AND interestingly Powell has come up with some clever plays.

I firmly believe Wane it too pig headed and stupid to ever become a great coach. He may have found his true level coaching juniors/reserves.

[DaveO]

Did you mention or anyone else that Tierney was not ready after the Widnes game.

Yes people did:

http://www.wiganwarriorsfans.com/wigan/ ... c&o=854156

As for offering an opinion hows this for hindsight i did not post this last week as i know the reaction i would have got. I would have played a weaken side at Wire taken the battering and put out a stronger side against Cas and been 3 points clear today. Rested Sam, Faz, Mossop and 1 or 2 more. Gives a chance that finishing top 2 and rest players towards the last 2 weeks of the season.

I don't think that is unreasonable and I think may have been suggested on rlfans. IIRC others said if we beat Wire it was a four pointer so lets try and win. Both valid opinions worth discussing.

I generally have no issues with your opinions it seems that some might. My issue is with the geniuses who said nothing for 14 weeks. But were complaining about Wane during the Hock situation. Its obvious 1 or 2 on here can not be objective when it comes to him. He does make mistakes and Murphy last season was the biggey. But name me a coach that got it right every time. Even Madge bollocked it after the CC final when he played the full team against Crusaders and we looked shot to pieces but tbh even that season we were not the side we were towards August on-wards.

Yes Madge wasn't infallible but he had two trophies to fall back on. Wane on the other hand threw the Madge way out of the window which IMO was an incredibly arrogant thing to do. I think the point CPW has made is a good one about a coach should set the game plan based on his teams capability not on what he would like to play.

We play the same way regardless of who is on the pitch and what the conditions are. This means when the 1st team is out there we are always competitive but when they aren't it only takes a half decent side like Cas to beat us.

Wanes biggest fault is IL is happy to let players go mid contract and thus weakness the squad. But i bet for 1 or 2 that is Wanes fault.

Depends if Wane is complicit in players leaving or not. He was only too keen to tell us Sam was going to leave. I think Wane has unrealistic expectations of some players which may mean when IL says he will sell Sam Wane says OK we can cope.

As I said I think he has this kind of Roy of the Rovers mentality where he throws in the young kids and if it works will be ready to stick his chest out about how clever he is. But this isn't a comic strip where ex-Wigan hero's son comes in and puts in a MoM performance.

[jobo]

Depends if Wane is complicit in players leaving or not. He was only too keen to tell us Sam was going to leave. I think Wane has unrealistic expectations of some players which may mean when IL says he will sell Sam Wane says OK we can cope

You couldn't be more wrong here Dave. He's got to remain positive, even if his best player is leaving. He should be congratulated for holding things together so well despite the uncertainty surrounding the squad at the moment.

[Kol]

"Michael Maguire has put a structure in place, which is going to carry on, but I feel I can improve things.

"There's been games this year I don't think we should have lost and it's my job as head coach to make sure the lads are prepared and we win those games.""

Ego / stupidity call it what you want BUT IMO I am not sure Wane truly learned the most significant lessons he should have from Madge.

Essentially RL is a simple game. You run straight and hard with minimal passing to avoid potential mistakes and in doing so you work over the opposition forwards sometimes more than once in a set. Fast POTBs, get on the front foot to provide your kickers with the time to make the opposition bring the ball back from deep met by a gang of willing chasers.

I believe the modern term is the 'arm wrestle'

Madge understood RL IMO far better than Wane ever will. The time to play elaborately is in the opposition 20. Look at Wire, the one spell where we started to get the ascendancy we were direct, even scooting, dare I say one out and we got on the front foot which then gave our backs the time and space in their 20 to create some havoc. Ironically, Wire are now more direct and we are somewhat a mirror image of Wire when they won the LLS and destroyed teams with cricket scores. Sure it looks wonderful BUT it is not 'FINAL FOOTBALL' Hence, why the clueless Wane criticised Madge and his teams for not destroying teams in meaningless games by higher scores. Perhaps Madge understood about process and habits.

Lateral running / passing; too many passes ESPECIALLY in your own half wins plaudits when it comes off BUT IN BIG GAMES / IN FINALS FOOTBALL IT FAILS FAR MORE THAN IT WINS. What do fans want? cricket scores in meaningless matches or victories when it matters. IMO, Wane is holding Wigan RLFC back with his abandonment or ignorance towards the lesson Madge provided him with on a daily basis because he seemingly knows better. I would suggest the opposite.

150% Correct, well said.

[TrueBlueWarrior]

DaveO 'people' might have said Tierney wasn't ready but did you? Like I have said in the past you do argue your point very well but sometimes you only have an opinion with hindsight, and like 'people' say 'it is a wonderful thing'!!

CP, to compare the Tierney situation to the Murphy one is not fair, SW messed up big time with Murphy in the Semi and that is why this time he might have tried Tierney earlier because of what happened with Murphy. I think SW has far more positives regarding youngsters going for him than against him.

[devon jim 1]

I agree with you entirely in your last post. So let me say I support SW's decisions because I trust him and further he is in a better position than we fans to make team decisions. Yes the forum is here for us to express our opinions and I must say that I have learned a lot frm Dave O, your good self and Kitt Wazzer. I live a distance from Wigan. I love the club and would not wish to detract from any opinion expressed nor castigate those I don't agree with. I apologise to Dave if I have caused offence. His Knowledge is greater than mine. In my defence this forum is the only means of keeping in touch with our great game. all the best to tou all