Are we watching a second rate comp?

[cpwigan]

It's not that simple! When we had no cap we couldn't compete at the top level. There are fundamental problems with the structure of the British game, everything cannot be blamed on salaries.

Exactly, they could double, but it but it will still not attract top Union players in our country or top NRL players at their peak.

All we can do now is keep producing our own young players and merge some clubs to have bigger and stronger clubs to compete at the level of the NRL.

Fair point. But maybe raising the salary cap would stop us losing some of our best players?

Yes it would and become viable for some, not the very best NRL / Union players. However, money is not a panacea for all issues. British sports fans prefer 'entertainment' over excellence, indeed so do many others as exemplified by the Premier League. So versus each other flawed second rate competitions can be great. The problem is when the reality and the truth is exposed by international competition.

[The booze hound]

Raise the cap to OZ level,and then we can compete. SIMPLES

It would raise the standard of Super League, however, I don't see how raising the cap creates better English players. It just enables us to sign better quality Aussies (and keep Sam T and the Burgess boys, but can't think of any other English players that are a big loss to our comp)

[Wigan_forever1985]

Yes we are simple as that.

I dont think the cap has much to do with it either

I think the main problem our comp has is the lack of intensity due to the talent pool being smaller but still persevering with a 12 team league.

The maximum our talent pool can reasonably expect to sustain is 8 id say. That would provide 8 teams capable of winning the league. At the moment there are 4.

During the WCC against the roosters the aussie commentators even said this wigan team playing in the NRL would be a real handful, but we dont have enough intensity in our league to bring players on and improve them, push them to their limits.

I know that the NRL has its poor teams too but the "weak" teams still have a lot of talent in them, wheras here the weak teams are weak

I do think like CP says coaching is poor in this country and i truly believe that is in part due to the differences in attitudes between the countries. In countries like Australia and America, they see someone with talent and push them hard, and they make others around them aspire to be that good. In this country we are programmed to drag people down to the slowest rather than speed up to the fastest. We are almost embarrassed about true talent

[Wiganer Ted]

Maybe we are, I'm not sure.
Warrington should have won and would have done if Thaler had sent off the StG/Ill winger.
Even if he had binned the winger and Marshall Wire would still have won.
As soon as Bentham was named I knew we wouldn't win. As for the pen in extra time it says everything about Bentham we need to know.
Saints just got beaten by a far, far better team. It's they who made us look second rate and uncompetitive.
They weren't that bad but Souths were just so much better.
Neither us or Wire would have beaten Souths.

[morley pie eater]

Yes we are simple as that.

I dont think the cap has much to do with it either

I think the main problem our comp has is the lack of intensity due to the talent pool being smaller but still persevering with a 12 team league.

The maximum our talent pool can reasonably expect to sustain is 8 id say. That would provide 8 teams capable of winning the league. At the moment there are 4.

During the WCC against the roosters the aussie commentatorsD even said this wigan team playing in the NRL would be a real handful, but we dont have enough intensity in our league to bring players on and improve them, push them to their limits.

I know that the NRL has its poor teams too but the "weak" teams still have a lot of talent in them, wheras here the weak teams are weak

I do think like CP says coaching is poor in this country and i truly believe that is in part due to the differences in attitudes between the countries. In countries like Australia and America, they see someone with talent and push them hard, and they make others around them aspire to be that good. In this country we are programmed to drag people down to the slowest rather than speed up to the fastest. We are almost embarrassed about true talent

Great post! The move to 14 teams was gross stupidity. 12 is a step in the right direction.

The problem is that self-interest and ignorance prevent people seeing the glaringly obvious - that a sport producing around 100 top class players (at a generous estimate) can't support a 12 or 14 team league. Only 4 or 5 clubs have proven productive academies, which should be an essential requirement of Super League status. Hence Wigan produce a Sam T but SL can't offer him a viable comp.

The only way we'll move the game forward is to start from the ground up - a league as small as 8 or as many as meet the criterion of having an academy that produces enough SL-standard players to sustain a team.

A 10-year plan needed to get to the point where we can even think about comparing ourselves to Aus.

[Owd Codger]

Exactly, they could double, but it but it will still not attract top Union players in our country or top NRL players at their peak.

All we can do now is keep producing our own young players and merge some clubs to have bigger and stronger clubs to compete at the level of the NRL.

Fair point. But maybe raising the salary cap would stop us losing some of our best players?

Yes it would and become viable for some, not the very best NRL / Union players. However, money is not a panacea for all issues. British sports fans prefer 'entertainment' over excellence, indeed so do many others as exemplified by the Premier League. So versus each other flawed second rate competitions can be great. The problem is when the reality and the truth is exposed by international competition.

We have to have a Salary Cap otherwise some clubs would fold, but at the same time it should be kept on a pro rata basis in accordance with Union and the NRL.

If it is not, we will go further behind Union and the NRL.

[Mike]

I'm not sure those are pro-rata. They have absolute limits?

Btw if we are suggesting dropping to 8 teams anyway then why not let some teams go bust?

[cpwigan]

A smaller elite division is one way to gain an advantage over the NRL whereby as they expand they dilute the quality. Perhaps the division changing mid season re the current decision and P&R makes it more acceptable to the RL masses. I think Mo Lindsay was right but sport in Britain has always been based on emotions not rational decision making.

[Owd Codger]

A smaller elite division is one way to gain an advantage over the NRL whereby as they expand they dilute the quality. Perhaps the division changing mid season re the current decision and P&R makes it more acceptable to the RL masses. I think Mo Lindsay was right but sport in Britain has always been based on emotions not rational decision making.

Yes, we now have a second rate competition due to our game being run on sentiment and tradition and not facing up to fact that times have changed where the game in Australia is concerned and union here has become far stronger.

A few seasons ago, the Aussies without the opinion of supporters, merged some of their clubs into bigger and stronger clubs with the result that they now have a stronger league both on the playing side and financially.

As long as we continue to allow supporters to dictate on mergers, we will never compete with them.

[Stormfan]

I think the nrl should block the titans from the league as they have always had money problems and not many members and gate takings are low. They should merge the weaker clubs.. tigers and sharks or sharks and eels. Then a team could be relocatd in Perth to make it a national comp.