Tonight's Match - Wigan squad for Hull FC

[the pieman]

That the team didn't play well v Hull FC is obvious. They still managed to get the win mainly due to field position in the GP period. So what was the problem?

First off, three of our four starting props weren't available due to injury or suspension. Cooper, Ellis and Havard would all be missed if there was just one out but three out of the four makes a massive difference. We have a quality squad so should be able to bring in reasonable replacements. They are reasonable but not as good as the three players missing. Isa has the 11 shirt and he was missing too.

As above, didn't go but listened to Milko and watched the full game on Wigan TV yesterday.
The frustration of Joe and Andy was plain, same for me. Whether that was for the same reasons I don't know.
My beef is that we don't have completely different game tactics for poor weather and good weather. Maybe different squad selection and team selection too. Positional changes as well?
Our season starts in February when the weather is awful, improves through summer when everything is different to February then late September and October it can become poor again.

We all know this so why don't we have different tactics? Tweak the squad and team with perhaps positional changes?

The changes when SL started we were told was because we were changing to "summer rugby". OK but I think it's not summer rugby but seasonal rugby as the game is played through the four seasons. We need to improve that's for all to see so changes need to be made to get that improvement both to the squad, team selection and tactics as the rugby season goes through the year's four seasons.

good summary Ted, and tbf i hadnt realised Ellis hadnt played either when i watched it back

i think the only thing wrong with Friday night was our lack of finishing / composure. We dominated the game virtually from the 1st to 80th minute, and there is no way we should have had to score to level the game, but thats how it went. Hull scored 1 well worked try and 1 with a bit of luck involved, but other than that rarely troubled our defence.

Onto commentary, and i think they see the game as we do as fans, and thus, sometimes the commentary is like FFS, why has he done that i.e Smith going of the drop kick that won it. Mills had literally just come out with it as the drop kick sailed over as Flash said , and then looked stupid in commentary. On one hand its good to listen to but equally i think they need to lose the fan element (if you can at a live game)

[EagleEyePie]

i listened to most of the game on Friday and watched it back on Warriors tv yesterday. In commentary it was commented a couple of times from Mills and Bilko that he was playing poorly / wasnt a 6

however, he created the King try, and would have created another had Nsemba not fallen over / tripped (unsure if he was caught accidentally or not)

what others appear to be missing as well, is that the Hull defensive line was up very quickly out wide, and thus the slow play of the ball / distribution meant that he literally had no time to do anything with the ball. This is where a natural 6 may cope better but in time, there is no reason why French cant handle that better than he may be doing at the minute

In regards to suggestions of moving on Miski so French can play wing, yes, that could be an option, but there is 1 big thing that may prevent that, and that is the salary cap. We cant just sign a world class No 6 to play in place of French if we dont have the cap space, so much as you think that is the simple option, its not a simple as you may hope / think

I've noticed this a few times too, but admittedly it must be difficult to commentate on the team you support every week without your own subjective opinions creeping in.

The French at halfback criticisms are a running theme. When we don't score it's because French isn't a halfback and it's not working, yet we score more points with French at halfback than without. French is apparently 'not linking' with Smith and Field before we've even had an opportunity to spread the ball wide and try to put a play on and when French does create something it's quickly forgotten when we're not scoring on every play again. Joe Mills has said he thinks Cust should be playing 6 but when Cust was playing 6 at the start of the year he was getting just as exasperated with him.

That's the problem with commentary coming from 2 fans. Their chances of being accurate with what they see and say is as likely as comments on here being accurate. Sometimes they'll be spot on. Other times they can be compelling but not fully informed. Commentary always works best with a commentator and a guest who has first hand knowledge of the professional game who can interpret why things are happening. Probably not possible with Wigan TV's budget but occasionally for reserve or academy games they've had reserve or youth team staff on commentary who have been very insightful, and the commentator less opinionated being alongside someone better placed to correct them. But it is what it is. Their commentary has always been a bit divisive as far as I can tell.

When it comes to French, I do find it interesting that him playing at 6 apparently isn't working even though he's our most creative player from that position, more so than Smith. But apparently Smith struggling to create is a result of French not being a 6? It doesn't make sense to me. All the blame when our attack stutters or we don't score is put on French rather than Smith.

I've also seen it suggested that Field would be better if French wasn't at 6. This is Field who has 7 tries and 8 assists in 8 games since French went to 6, as opposed to 3 tries and 6 assists in 6 games before French was at 6. There's not a huge difference there despite the change in personnel.

Smith's assists are currently lower than they were at the start of the year and it's fair to say his form is nowhere close to what it was at the start of the year. Obviously stats don't tell you everything and are just one part of the wider context, but I don't think it's fair to be putting so much of the blame on French for our attack when we're scoring more points with him at 6 and he has 15 direct try involvements in 8 games (as does Field in the same timeframe).

Our attacking issues preceded French moving to 6 and were present even when Smith was at his best for the first 6 or 7 games.

[moto748]

I watched the match back last night too and I have to say that both Mills and Bilko are what I would call "agenda commentating". They're calling the match according to an already set agenda. The 2 most obvious examples where both against Harry Smith; one were Bilko said "where was Harry Smith on that play" (sic) when he had literally just passed the ball and Mills' reaction of "Oh dear!" or "Dear me!" (can't remember the exact wording) to Harry's match winning drop goal!!!

I like them, as a rule, but they seriously need to get there heads from up their a*ses and commentate on what's actually happening, rather than trying to "prove" what they already think.

A hobby-horse of mine, it's confirmation bias. All commentators tend to do it, to some extent, even (especially?) the sainted Cooper Cronk on the NRL. They approach the game with a script already written in their heads.

[Karl Carpenter]

Regarding the commentary; I enjoy the enthusiasm of Joe Mills but he very often gets players names wrong and on Friday when that bit of push and shove started he saw “fists flying everywhere” when there wasn’t one punch thrown.

[Charriots Offiah]

Regarding the commentary; I enjoy the enthusiasm of Joe Mills but he very often gets players names wrong and on Friday when that bit of push and shove started he saw “fists flying everywhere” when there wasn’t one punch thrown.

Listen to the commentary from the Salford game (away), all they prattled on about is the weather!

[Firestarter]

Leon pryce said that marshall was wading in with punches

[archiekeith]

Regarding the commentary; I enjoy the enthusiasm of Joe Mills but he very often gets players names wrong and on Friday when that bit of push and shove started he saw “fists flying everywhere” when there wasn’t one punch thrown.

Listen to the commentary from the Salford game (away), all they prattled on about is the weather!

. That's probably because they were agenda commentating (see flash's post above

[EDINBURGH-WARRIOR]

Regarding the commentary; I enjoy the enthusiasm of Joe Mills but he very often gets players names wrong and on Friday when that bit of push and shove started he saw “fists flying everywhere” when there wasn’t one punch thrown.

Bilko is a very knowledgeable guy on all things Wigan . Joe Mills must be close to the worst commentator ever in RL imo . Couldn't listen to him for more than a few minutes . Would rather watch flashscore on my phone for updates than listen to him

EW

[Firestarter]

The worst part of listening to our radio commentators is there annoying “Ohs”. Not sure which one it is but im usually in work thinking wtf??? Its like your on the radio mate and we havent a clur whats happened.I think they think its on tv at times

[endoman]

agree re the ooh's etc. They need to paint a picture with words cos we haven't a clue what they have seen or are ooing about. Radio and TV commentary are 2 different things.