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Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:34 am
by cpwigan
People like AW are better served to answer this but I would say 99% of police officers do a fantastic and worthwhile job, a very pressurised job. The actions of 1% make headlines, headlines that soon become fish and chip wrappers. However, the failings of the legal system / CPS whatever you want to call it are far more damaging on a daily basis and in the long term have far more serious repercussions.
It is exactly the same in this disciplinary issue. Sensational easy, LAZY media has detracted from the real issue. The incompetence of the RFL!
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:38 am
by Wigan_forever1985
Im not sure what all the viva revolution people want i mean youre all intent on saying how is such a traveisty etc but i havent seen much in the way of suggestions on how to move forward just how crap the current system is.
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:39 am
by thegimble
TrueBlueWarrior wrote:josie andrews wrote:butt monkey wrote:How long a ban did the "Saintly" Rangi Chase receive for breaking Tangi Ropati's jaw in another televised match?
Four games, Ropati was out of action for four months I think it was.
....but remember guys it was not in a Grand Final so that makes it all ok!!
He could have shot him and then physically abused the corpse and he would have got less than Flower did.
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:40 am
by cpwigan
Wigan_forever1985 wrote:TrueBlueWarrior wrote:Why should Ben Flower be the fall guy because of the media frenzy, far worse has happened in the past yet he is made out to be the Devil. IT IS NOT FAIR!!
Its life though, a drunk driver killing someone and getting 3 years isnt fair but it happens. If i speed at 70mph in a 30mph zone and there are no police around i get away with it another person may get done for 33 in a 30 zone and not.
I go back to the same argument i had with the Gaz Hock thing, no one forced Ben Flower to pin down lance hohaia and smack him for that second time, he made that choice, he made it wrong. The stage he made it on has influenced his ban no doubt, but he was in the wrong. Saying others get away with less doesnt make what Flower did anymore correct.
I agree with whoever posted the comment along the lines of Flowers ban was probably correct its others that have been wrong rather than the other way round.
The RFL were under massive pressure from the media to deal with Flower which they have done. Like ive said this may work in Flowers favor, a short ban would of led to this issue being dragged out, it would of been all over the press everytime we won and match that he shouldnt even be out there etc etc.
This ban gives Flower and the sport time to move on, he is still only young and he has his best years as a forward ahead of him. 10 games (realistically) is not that bad, the season doesnt start till the play offs anyway so he will be more than up to speed.
Wigan fans kicking off IMO are making the situation worse we should accept it and move on let the subject go, get back to the grand final and watch Ben have the game of his life and then he can put this all behind him.
Ben will never put this behind him. Do you honestly think he is not going to be abused routinely by every opposition support, opposition players.
Everything you suggest is wrong on so many fronts. People who make a difference in life 'fight' for what they believe and bring about positive change. I am going to throw a gaping extreme here; evil such as Hitler existed and thrived because the majority buried their heads in the sand and pretended it never happened. You are asking RL fans to bury their heads in the sand and pretend it never happened.
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:42 am
by gillysmyhero
Wigan_forever1985 wrote:Im not sure what all the viva revolution people want i mean youre all intent on saying how is such a traveisty etc but i havent seen much in the way of suggestions on how to move forward just how crap the current system is.
Just for the RFL to be consistent with the way they deal with incidents. Not to much to ask really is it.
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:42 am
by Wigan_forever1985
Ok CP then what is your plan of action how would you ensure that this doesnt happen again
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:43 am
by cpwigan
Wigan_forever1985 wrote:Im not sure what all the viva revolution people want i mean youre all intent on saying how is such a traveisty etc but i havent seen much in the way of suggestions on how to move forward just how crap the current system is.
The first stage of positive change / difference is just that; acknowledge the system is badly flawed. To do so puts things a country mile ahead of your let's bury our heads in the sand philosophy. A philosophy that allows the same unjust, unfair events to happen time and time again.
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:44 am
by TrueBlueWarrior
Wigan_forever1985 wrote:Im not sure what all the viva revolution people want i mean youre all intent on saying how is such a traveisty etc but i havent seen much in the way of suggestions on how to move forward just how crap the current system is.
I don't get paid to give the RFL ideas on how to improve the discipline procedures but somebody surely does, why are they not accountable.
The whole RFL is imcompetent and run like a circus. Why don't they look at other sports where funding, marketing, management, structures, discipline are all at an acceptable standard. Of course there will be mistakes every now and again but it is about learning from them which the RFL never do.
For me we start right at the top and freshen things up right through, I mean GH for a start, how is his position accepted?
It is not rocket science it is simply about employing people that are better at the job than the current position holder.
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:45 am
by thegimble
cpwigan wrote:Wigan_forever1985 wrote:TrueBlueWarrior wrote:Why should Ben Flower be the fall guy because of the media frenzy, far worse has happened in the past yet he is made out to be the Devil. IT IS NOT FAIR!!
Its life though, a drunk driver killing someone and getting 3 years isnt fair but it happens. If i speed at 70mph in a 30mph zone and there are no police around i get away with it another person may get done for 33 in a 30 zone and not.
I go back to the same argument i had with the Gaz Hock thing, no one forced Ben Flower to pin down lance hohaia and smack him for that second time, he made that choice, he made it wrong. The stage he made it on has influenced his ban no doubt, but he was in the wrong. Saying others get away with less doesnt make what Flower did anymore correct.
I agree with whoever posted the comment along the lines of Flowers ban was probably correct its others that have been wrong rather than the other way round.
The RFL were under massive pressure from the media to deal with Flower which they have done. Like ive said this may work in Flowers favor, a short ban would of led to this issue being dragged out, it would of been all over the press everytime we won and match that he shouldnt even be out there etc etc.
This ban gives Flower and the sport time to move on, he is still only young and he has his best years as a forward ahead of him. 10 games (realistically) is not that bad, the season doesnt start till the play offs anyway so he will be more than up to speed.
Wigan fans kicking off IMO are making the situation worse we should accept it and move on let the subject go, get back to the grand final and watch Ben have the game of his life and then he can put this all behind him.
Ben will never put this behind him. Do you honestly think he is not going to be abused routinely by every opposition support, opposition players.
Everything you suggest is wrong on so many fronts. People who make a difference in life 'fight' for what they believe and bring about positive change. I am going to throw a gaping extreme here; evil such as Hitler existed and thrived because the majority buried their heads in the sand and pretended it never happened. You are asking RL fans to bury their heads in the sand and pretend it never happened.
There is an issue here of total discrimination by RFL towards Flower. I have no problem with his ban but why have the RFL treated LH and Westwood differently for both making direct contact to the head of a player in a vulnerable position.
Flower did not expect to get the ball so he did not expect to be hit. For Green he was held down and hit.
The ban is not the issue the issue is the leniancey shown to others. No one is saying what Flower did was wrong. But hardly anyone outside these forums and Cherryandwhite are saying what LH and Westwood did was wrong and they got away with it.
Re: Six month ban for Flower
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:46 am
by cpwigan
Wigan_forever1985 wrote:Ok CP then what is your plan of action how would you ensure that this doesnt happen again
1) Update the code of conduct for players
2) Update the disciplinary procedures
3) Significantly improve the officiating of RL
4) Root/branch investigation into the governance of RL
OR
WF Et Al can put their buckets of sand over their heads.