Micky Mac

Discuss all things Wigan Warriors. Comments and opinions on all aspects of the club's performance are welcome.
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Panchitta Marra
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Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:24 pm

Re: Micky Mac

Post by Panchitta Marra »

cpwigan wrote:
cow yeds wrote:
cpwigan wrote: Not see any replays BUT many who have say first contact was with the shoulder. Unfortunately this is not junior or amateur RL and the players are coached / expected to make contact above the ball when making their hit / tackle.

To All IIRC Mac has taken Roby to the cleaners 3 times this season.
Just ask yourself why is it Roby is rated the best in England, not Mac??

We used to call Cunningham too but he was the best in his time. (We'd have had him in a heart beat, if we could).

you have to look at things more broadly.

I think Roby is a gud un. I wish he was ours.
Nowhere have I said Roby is not a good player BUT I am reminding people that he has been outplayed by Mac every time this season when they have faced each other. Yet we have some of our fans who seem to want to write Mac off for a sending off that our coach feels was unfair. Personally I can appreciate good / bad players from every team. KC was better than our hooker, better than Roby. Roby is an excellent player. James Graham was / is an excellent player BUT so is Micky Mac.

Ironically one of the posters rearing his head here wanted rid of Gaz Hock after he was sent off v Wire. This season never bad mouthed him once here albeit he has on RLfans. He frequently slated Lockers too. Now it seems Mac is his new whipping boy. Oddly he rates Rinaldi and Ah Van. I say no more.
Been saying the same about Mac for a while now.
Madge put Micky Mac on as first hooker in the 2010 Grand Final to nulify KFC, and I dare say MADGE got it right.
Mac now nulifies James Robey in the very same way.
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michael inch stoke
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Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 12:07 am

Re: Micky Mac

Post by michael inch stoke »

pieaterinLeigh wrote:I've played the game and also enjoyed being an avid spectator for most of my life but I do have a few points from having read this thread.

It's physical, contact based and should always be so as the game would lose a large element of its appeal if it continues to move towards football's example of appealing for everything and play acting to ensure referee's decisions go the way the player hopes. We revel in the fact this is a mans game and our boys get stitches and replace dislocated joints before rejoining the game without need for fanfare.

But let's be clear, foul play is foul play irrespective of which jersey the player is wearing, we are up in arms when our players are blind sided, hit late or punched and we can't be so myopic to ignore when our own do wrong. It was a head high hit with the arm not shoulder and was after the ball had gone, where is the defence against that being foul play?

The second issue is how should that be punished? IMHO the referee got it right in line with the laws of the game, yes it spoiled the game for the spectators but surely that's Mickey's fault for committing the offence rather than the referee's for punishing it? Any loss against that lot always hurts but we as fans need to point our frustrations in the right direction. While this Might not be written in the rules anywhere, I'm all for letting rugby league players regulate themselves during the game by putting the opposition right and showing each other who's boss, but a cheap late shot doesn't count in that category in my eyes.

In some ways the sending off might be a blessing? Had Childs not punished it immediately then the RFL would certainly have come back with more than the ban he will now get. Wigan can (as Wane has stated) use the argument that he as already effectively served a 1 game ban and that should be sufficient. Leaving Mickey to be free for play off games, his b0llocking off the coach and ears ringing with the advice to choose his shots better.

There seems to be a lot of wailing on here about victimisation of Wigan from the RFL and referees and yes there are examples where other team's payers have been treated more leniently than ours but administrators and match officials are human and therefore are subjective, we have been successful over a long period of time and that does sometimes count against you in any sport. Even if we are being victimised, the louder we complain the happier it will make the people doing it and encourage them to do it more!

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

(not trying to Bible bash just bring a little common sense)

For me Micky is a very good player who uses the physical side of his game to become an extra forward who also delivers the ball from dummy half, rather than Roby who is more elusive in his running and almost an extra half back even though they play with the same number on. Therefore, theres no real debate about who's best they are just very different players who each offer diffrent positives to their teams.

Can we be honest in saying that if Roby was a Warrior and Micky a Stain the majority of opinion would be reversed?

That being said, we are a better team with Micky playing and can any of the detractors offer a better alternative? Our style of play suits a physical hooker given we have creative ball players in the halves, at full back and at loose forward, for these reasons I for one wouldn't change Mickey. I would however tell him to pick his moments to bully the opposition better as he has no need to resort to cheap, late shots ( even against that lot!)
Good post :eusa2: :eusa2:
cow yeds
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Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 10:42 am

Re: Micky Mac

Post by cow yeds »

Panchitta Marra wrote:
cpwigan wrote:
cow yeds wrote: Just ask yourself why is it Roby is rated the best in England, not Mac??

We used to call Cunningham too but he was the best in his time. (We'd have had him in a heart beat, if we could).

you have to look at things more broadly.

I think Roby is a gud un. I wish he was ours.
Nowhere have I said Roby is not a good player BUT I am reminding people that he has been outplayed by Mac every time this season when they have faced each other. Yet we have some of our fans who seem to want to write Mac off for a sending off that our coach feels was unfair. Personally I can appreciate good / bad players from every team. KC was better than our hooker, better than Roby. Roby is an excellent player. James Graham was / is an excellent player BUT so is Micky Mac.

Ironically one of the posters rearing his head here wanted rid of Gaz Hock after he was sent off v Wire. This season never bad mouthed him once here albeit he has on RLfans. He frequently slated Lockers too. Now it seems Mac is his new whipping boy. Oddly he rates Rinaldi and Ah Van. I say no more.
Been saying the same about Mac for a while now.
Madge put Micky Mac on as first hooker in the 2010 Grand Final to nulify KFC, and I dare say MADGE got it right.
Mac now nulifies James Robey in the very same way.
How does a hooker nullify another hooker??

KOOCH
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Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 10:24 am

Re: Micky Mac

Post by KOOCH »

ian.birchall wrote:
KOOCH wrote:.Wigan are a much better team with him in it than out of it.Also it was nice to hear the saints supporters admit that we where the much better team despite the loss. :D
Give over, which home have you been let out of, stains were all over us all the game, their defence was killing us all game and their tactic of continually kicking the ball long over our dead ball line was well thought out as they were right in thinking their defence would keep us away from their try line if it was 80 yards away.
We got in 10 minutes late having spent rather more than 2 and a half hours getting to the game from Leeds as the M62 was closed up to Huddersfield and the congestion/confusion was appalling but watching the first 10 minutes on t'box suggested that our first try was against the run of play as they were all over us from the kick off.
Got out of the same asylum as you! I seem to remember you being infront of me waiting for your happy pills.Have you been to spec savers lately because if so they obviously gave you the wrong prescription.On a serious note though.I am not going to dismiss admiration of our team from stains supporters.I suggest that you look at the second half display from our boys 12 playing 13 then tell me I'm wrong.Oh and by the way. I also travel from the West Midlands and often face similar traffic problems as yourself. :D
cpwigan
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Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 11:03 pm

Re: Micky Mac

Post by cpwigan »

As God says the hooker is normally an A defender alongside props. A good defensive hooker closes the gaps Roby would like to scoot into and stops Roby taking on big props.

I rate Roby highly BUT more for his workrate. He was a better attacking hooker when combining with KC and coming off the interchange.

Mac still needs to keep working on his attacking game (which has improved) but I have yet to see any young player capable of legally and destructively hitting an opponent hard in a 1 v 1 tackle when playing U20s and below. He is somebody you want next to you in the trenches.
DaveO
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Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 5:32 pm

Re: Micky Mac

Post by DaveO »

pieaterinLeigh wrote: But let's be clear, foul play is foul play irrespective of which jersey the player is wearing, we are up in arms when our players are blind sided, hit late or punched and we can't be so myopic to ignore when our own do wrong. It was a head high hit with the arm not shoulder and was after the ball had gone, where is the defence against that being foul play?
Technically you could argue he never actually connected with his arm on the head (his arm hit the shoulder first then went over it), the Saints player milked it for all it was worth and MM was committed to the tackle with the player ducking into it.

That is, having watched it, the mitigation I would use.

However you seem be labouring under a misapprehension - that "foul play is foul play". If that were true there would be at least one sending off per game.
The second issue is how should that be punished? IMHO the referee got it right in line with the laws of the game, yes it spoiled the game for the spectators but surely that's Mickey's fault for committing the offence rather than the referee's for punishing it?


Given no damage was done you have to ask does the punishment fit the crime? Again technically all head high shots are red cards. Few are. So yes I blame the referee for over reacting. It was early on in the game and he had several options open to him. There is nothing in the rules to say he had to send him off. I don't think it warranted a sending off given how other head-high shots are dealt with.
Any loss against that lot always hurts but we as fans need to point our frustrations in the right direction. While this Might not be written in the rules anywhere, I'm all for letting rugby league players regulate themselves during the game by putting the opposition right and showing each other who's boss, but a cheap late shot doesn't count in that category in my eyes.
I don't think you need to let players self-regulate anyway but that and the result are not the issue.
In some ways the sending off might be a blessing? Had Childs not punished it immediately then the RFL would certainly have come back with more than the ban he will now get. Wigan can (as Wane has stated) use the argument that he as already effectively served a 1 game ban and that should be sufficient. Leaving Mickey to be free for play off games, his b0llocking off the coach and ears ringing with the advice to choose his shots better.
He has been charged with a grade C offence. Minimum ban 2 games max 3. Regardless of how bad the tackle was if he is found guilty we will have to get to GF final for him to play again if he is lucky.
There seems to be a lot of wailing on here about victimisation of Wigan from the RFL and referees and yes there are examples where other team's payers have been treated more leniently than ours but administrators and match officials are human and therefore are subjective, we have been successful over a long period of time and that does sometimes count against you in any sport. Even if we are being victimised, the louder we complain the happier it will make the people doing it and encourage them to do it more!
Consistency is what is asked for and there isn't any. It's not "wailing".
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

(not trying to Bible bash just bring a little common sense)
It still comes across as holier than thou.
Can we be honest in saying that if Roby was a Warrior and Micky a Stain the majority of opinion would be reversed?
My honest opinion is were roles reversed and had Roby not been sent off the tackle would have been forgotten about by now.
That being said, we are a better team with Micky playing and can any of the detractors offer a better alternative? Our style of play suits a physical hooker given we have creative ball players in the halves, at full back and at loose forward, for these reasons I for one wouldn't change Mickey. I would however tell him to pick his moments to bully the opposition better as he has no need to resort to cheap, late shots ( even against that lot!)
You are making the massive assumption it was a deliberate cheap shot and not a mis-timed poorly executed tackle. You have decided he intended to injure the player in a way guaranteed to get him a red card. I think that is big assumption.
DaveO
Posts: 16034
Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 5:32 pm

Re: Micky Mac

Post by DaveO »

And here is one for your thoughts posted by a user on rlfans "captaindan"

"I listen in on a scanner to the referee, tough judges and video ref.

When MickyMac hit the tackle, the linesman said it was ok, then when the player did not get up, the ref stopped play and walked over to see what had gone on. Then, even though he had not been asked, Ganson shouted down the referee's ear,

'he made direct contact with the head, Direct Contact James, DIRECT CONTACT WITH THE HEAD'
It was obvious straight away that Ganson wanted him red carded and from that comment alone, Mr Child sent him off.

At half time, the ref was chatting to the touch judges and said, ' really did not see anything as I was blind sided, but Gans said there was direct contact so I thought I should send him off'

Whatever happened to the video ref saying nothing until asked, did we not learn that lesson when Ganson and Klein cocked up that grand final?
The RFL constantly deny that the fourth official or Video ref says anything, but after listening to them for the last few seasons you would be astonished at what is said.
Just watch on any TV game when the touch judges come in for a chat and don't actually say anything, the ref wll then say to them, yes, so you say he needs a card/penalty/castration....... and they all nod as the video ref has his say on proceedings that he has no right to comment on.

The day that the RFL make the referee's/ touch judges and vid ref's comments available to everyone by broadcasting them like other sports do, is the day that we can start to trust what is going on. Until then, the game is fixed and if I did not love my club, I would seriousley wonder why my money goes into such a crooked game."
cpwigan
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Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 11:03 pm

Re: Micky Mac

Post by cpwigan »

Effectively Mac has already served 1 match of any ban so without meaning to, Child may have done him a favour with the red card.
Jules
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Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:53 am

Re: Micky Mac

Post by Jules »

One point in his favour is that it is a serious offence. A serious offence has to be seen that way by the panel, there is no one match cop out.
Its an all or nothing, so we either lose him for the duration, or he walks. Doubt works in our favour.
He has faced many panels, and walked all but a couple of times.

There is hope :-)

Jules
East Stand Faithful
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Re: Micky Mac

Post by East Stand Faithful »

cpwigan wrote:Effectively Mac has already served 1 match of any ban so without meaning to, Child may have done him a favour with the red card.
CP I am not sure the RFL will see it that way. He was sent off in the 20 minute (approx) which is a quarter of the game.
Whatever happened to Billy McGinty's pineapple?
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